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Re: Hash algorithm analysis

From
ALAdam Langley <agl@google.com>
Date
Jul 22, 2018, 18:54 UTC
Message-ID
<CAL9PXLyNVLCCqV1ftRa3r4kuoamDZOF29HJEhv2JXrbHj1nirA@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To
<f5bb91e8-5189-7f61-e018-91447c42845e@noekeon.org>

Somewhere upthread, Brian refers to me as a cryptographer. That's flattering (thank you), but probably not really true even on a good day. And certainly not true next to Joan Daemen. I do have experience with crypto at scale and in ecosystems, though.

Joan's count of cryptanalysis papers is a reasonable way to try and bring some quantitative clarity to an otherwise subjective topic. But still, despite lacking any counterpoint to it, I find myself believing that practical concerns are a stronger differentiater here.

But the world is in a position where a new, common hash function might crystalise, and git could be the start of that. What that means for the ecosystem is is that numerous libraries need to grow implementations optimised for 3+ platforms and those platforms (esp Intel) often need multiple versions (e.g. for different vector widths) with code-size concerns pushing back at the same time. Intrinsics still don't cut it, so that means hand-assembly and thus dealing with gas vs Windows, CFI metadata, etc. Licensing differences mean that code-sharing doesn't work nearly as well as one might hope.

Then complexity spreads upwards as testing matrices expand with the combination of each signature algorithm with the new hash function, options in numerous protocols etc.

In short, picking just one would be lovely.

For that reason, I've held back from SHA3 (which I consider distinct from K12) because I didn't feel that it relieved enough pressure: people who wanted more performance weren't going to be satisfied. Other than that, I don't have strong feelings and, to be clear, K12 seems like a fine option.

But it does seem that a) there is probably not any more information to discover that is going to alter your decision and b) waiting a short to medium amount of time is probably not going to bring any definitive developments either.

Cheers
AGL
Previous: Joan DaemenNext: Johannes Schindelin
Message 25 of 66 in “State of NewHash work, future directions, and discussion”
  1. brian m. carlsonJun 9, 2018
  2. Ævar Arnfjörð BjarmasonJun 9, 2018
  3. Hash algorithm analysisbrian m. carlson, Jun 9, 2018
  4. Jonathan NiederJun 11, 2018
  5. Linus TorvaldsJun 11, 2018
  6. Ævar Arnfjörð BjarmasonJun 11, 2018
  7. David LangJun 12, 2018
  8. Linus TorvaldsJun 12, 2018
  9. brian m. carlsonJun 11, 2018
  10. Gilles Van AsscheJun 12, 2018
  11. brian m. carlsonJun 13, 2018
  12. Gilles Van AsscheJun 15, 2018
  13. brian m. carlsonJul 20, 2018
  14. Jonathan NiederJul 21, 2018
  15. Ævar Arnfjörð BjarmasonJul 21, 2018
  16. brian m. carlsonJul 21, 2018
  17. Johannes SchindelinJul 21, 2018
  18. Linus TorvaldsJul 21, 2018
  19. brian m. carlsonJul 21, 2018
  20. Eric DeplagneJul 22, 2018
  21. brian m. carlsonJul 22, 2018
  22. Eric DeplagneJul 22, 2018
  23. Johannes SchindelinJul 26, 2018
  24. Joan DaemenJul 22, 2018
  25. Adam LangleyJul 22, 2018
  26. Johannes SchindelinJul 26, 2018
  27. demerphqJul 23, 2018
  28. Sitaram ChamartyJul 23, 2018
  29. demerphqJul 23, 2018
  30. Linus TorvaldsJul 23, 2018
  31. Stefan BellerJul 23, 2018
  32. Jonathan NiederJul 23, 2018
  33. Edward ThomsonJul 24, 2018
  34. Linus TorvaldsJul 24, 2018
  35. Jonathan NiederJul 24, 2018
  36. Junio C HamanoJul 24, 2018
  37. brian m. carlsonJul 24, 2018
  38. Johannes SchindelinJul 30, 2018
  39. Dan ShumowJul 30, 2018
  40. Jonathan NiederAug 3, 2018
  41. Joan DaemenSep 18, 2018
  42. Jonathan NiederSep 18, 2018
  43. Linus TorvaldsSep 18, 2018
  44. 0/2 document that NewHash is now SHA-256Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason, Jul 25, 2018
  45. 1/2 doc hash-function-transition: note the lack of a changelogÆvar Arnfjörð Bjarmason, Jul 25, 2018
  46. 2/2 doc hash-function-transition: pick SHA-256 as NewHashÆvar Arnfjörð Bjarmason, Jul 25, 2018
  47. Junio C HamanoJul 25, 2018
  48. Jonathan NiederJul 25, 2018
  49. Junio C HamanoJul 25, 2018
  50. 2/2 doc hash-function-transition: pick SHA-256 as NewHashÆvar Arnfjörð Bjarmason, Jul 26, 2018
  51. Jonathan NiederAug 3, 2018
  52. Junio C HamanoAug 3, 2018
  53. Linus TorvaldsAug 3, 2018
  54. Linus TorvaldsAug 3, 2018
  55. Ævar Arnfjörð BjarmasonAug 3, 2018
  56. Jonathan NiederAug 4, 2018
  57. brian m. carlsonAug 3, 2018
  58. brian m. carlsonJul 25, 2018
  59. Ævar Arnfjörð BjarmasonJun 11, 2018
  60. Johannes SchindelinJun 21, 2018
  61. brian m. carlsonJun 21, 2018
  62. Duy NguyenJun 11, 2018
  63. brian m. carlsonJun 12, 2018
  64. Jonathan NiederJun 11, 2018
  65. brian m. carlsonJun 12, 2018
  66. Jonathan NiederJun 12, 2018

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