threads / discuss / 49987

Announcing Pro Git Second Edition Reedited

Subject: Announcing Pro Git Second Edition Reedited

## tl;dr

8 messages between Dec 9, 2018 and Dec 12, 2018.

replies: 7people: 5as markdown or json

Jon Forrest· Dec 9, 2018, 18:42 UTC · lore

Several years ago I released what I called Pro Git Reedited. This was an attempt to tighten up the text of the excellent Pro Git book written by Scott Chacon. Since then, Scott and Ben Straub released the second edition of Pro Git so once again I'm releasing a reedited version of what they wrote. I hope you enjoy it.

The PDF of my version is at
https://drive.google.com/file/d/18wGebSU0dyYU1L_bfyoDQtZRF1Vo1H3p/view?usp=sharing

If there's enough interest, I'll try to put up an HTML version of the book.

Cordially, Jon Forrest

Jeff King· Dec 11, 2018, 10:50 UTC · re: Jon Forrest · lore

Re: Announcing Pro Git Second Edition Reedited

On Sun, Dec 09, 2018 at 10:42:12AM -0800, Jon Forrest wrote:
Show 12 quoted lines
> Several years ago I released what I called Pro Git Reedited. This was an
> attempt to tighten up the text of the excellent Pro Git book written by
> Scott Chacon. Since then, Scott and Ben Straub released the second
> edition of Pro Git so once again I'm releasing a reedited version of
> what they wrote. I hope you enjoy it.
> 
> The PDF of my version is at
> 
> https://drive.google.com/file/d/18wGebSU0dyYU1L_bfyoDQtZRF1Vo1H3p/view?usp=sharing
> 
> If there's enough interest, I'll try to put up an HTML version of
> the book.

The content at https://git-scm.com/book is pulled regularly from https://github.com/progit/progit2, which has collected a number of fixes (as well as translations) since the 2nd edition was released.

Have you considered sending some of your edits there? It sounds like they may be too large to just dump as a big PR, but it might be possible to grow together over time.

-Peff
Jon Forrest· Dec 11, 2018, 14:39 UTC · re: Jeff King · lore

Re: Announcing Pro Git Second Edition Reedited

On 12/11/2018 2:50 AM, Jeff King wrote:
Show 7 quoted lines
> The content at https://git-scm.com/book is pulled regularly from
> https://github.com/progit/progit2, which has collected a number of fixes
> (as well as translations) since the 2nd edition was released.
> 
> Have you considered sending some of your edits there? It sounds like
> they may be too large to just dump as a big PR, but it might be possible
> to grow together over time.

Fair question. I had tried doing this for the first edition of Pro Git, but the person who was in charge of accepting changes wasn't a native speaker of English. As a result I had a hard time convincing him that my changes were necessary. Many of my changes were very subjective, and not technical, so this was hard to overcome. Things might have been different if I were correcting technical errors or adding significant sections to the book. But, since I'm not a Git expert, that's not what I was attempting to do.

Things have changed for the better for the second edition of Pro Git. Its management seems much more willing to accept the kind of changes I make, as shown by their reaction to the excellent work by Robert Day. Even so, given the amount of changes I've made, it's unlikely that my changes would be accepted.

I do track the changes to the second edition of Pro Git and incorporate that ones that still apply into my version.

But I hear what you're saying. Maybe if and when the third edition of Pro Git comes out I'll try what you suggest.

Cordially, Jon Forrest

Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason· Dec 11, 2018, 15:13 UTC · re: Jon Forrest · lore

Re: Announcing Pro Git Second Edition Reedited

On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 4:02 PM Jon Forrest <nobozo@gmail.com> wrote:
Show 30 quoted lines
> On 12/11/2018 2:50 AM, Jeff King wrote:
>
> > The content at https://git-scm.com/book is pulled regularly from
> > https://github.com/progit/progit2, which has collected a number of fixes
> > (as well as translations) since the 2nd edition was released.
> >
> > Have you considered sending some of your edits there? It sounds like
> > they may be too large to just dump as a big PR, but it might be possible
> > to grow together over time.
>
> Fair question. I had tried doing this for the first edition of Pro Git,
> but the person who was in charge of accepting changes wasn't a
> native speaker of English. As a result I had a hard time
> convincing him that my changes were necessary. Many of my changes
> were very subjective, and not technical, so this was hard to overcome.
> Things might have been different if I were correcting technical errors
> or adding significant sections to the book. But, since I'm not a Git
> expert, that's not what I was attempting to do.
>
> Things have changed for the better for the second edition of Pro Git.
> Its management seems much more willing to accept the kind of changes
> I make, as shown by their reaction to the excellent work by Robert
> Day. Even so, given the amount of changes I've made, it's unlikely
> that my changes would be accepted.
>
> I do track the changes to the second edition of Pro Git and
> incorporate that ones that still apply into my version.
>
> But I hear what you're saying. Maybe if and when the third edition
> of Pro Git comes out I'll try what you suggest.

As someone who's read neither your edit or the original edition, but I did read your version of the intro, it would be very helpful to me / others if there was some diff between the two so we could make up our own mind about which one to read, and to get an idea of what sorts of wording changes etc. these are.

Jon Forrest· Dec 11, 2018, 17:00 UTC · re: Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason · lore

Re: Announcing Pro Git Second Edition Reedited

On 12/11/2018 7:13 AM, Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason wrote:
Show 5 quoted lines
> As someone who's read neither your edit or the original edition, but I
> did read your version of the intro, it would be very helpful to me /
> others if there was some diff between the two so we could make up our
> own mind about which one to read, and to get an idea of what sorts of
> wording changes etc. these are.

That would indeed be nice. The best I can do is to suggest that if you're satisfied with the regular Pro Git then my version won't help you. On the other hand, if you find regular Pro Git puzzling, especially in the early chapters, I suggest giving my version a try.

Since I'm giving away my version, you have nothing to loose except perhaps a little time. If I'm right, and my version is clearer, then you could benefit from it.

(You're a git expert so I doubt you need my version).

Cordially, Jon Forrest

Konstantin Khomoutov· Dec 11, 2018, 17:15 UTC · re: Jon Forrest · lore

Re: Announcing Pro Git Second Edition Reedited

On Tue, Dec 11, 2018 at 09:00:31AM -0800, Jon Forrest wrote:
Show 16 quoted lines
> > As someone who's read neither your edit or the original edition, but I
> > did read your version of the intro, it would be very helpful to me /
> > others if there was some diff between the two so we could make up our
> > own mind about which one to read, and to get an idea of what sorts of
> > wording changes etc. these are.
> 
> That would indeed be nice. The best I can do is to suggest that if
> you're satisfied with the regular Pro Git then my version won't
> help you. On the other hand, if you find regular Pro Git puzzling,
> especially in the early chapters, I suggest giving my version a try.
> 
> Since I'm giving away my version, you have nothing to loose except
> perhaps a little time. If I'm right, and my version is clearer, then
> you could benefit from it.
> 
> (You're a git expert so I doubt you need my version).

I think an uspoken issue here is that while you're indeed free to "fork" this book and maintain your fork, having two books with almost identical contents may not be the best option as it simply may be outright confusing for those at whom your fork is actually targeted.

That's just my opinion, or — better — feeling I gathered from the discussion, but to me these friendly nudges to maybe consider reevaluating your work for inclusion into the original's book proper look exactly as hints at that having such a fork may not be the best of all options.

Another problem with the fork is its visibility. The go-to Git website links to the original work, and I assure you novice users do not casually read this list — let alone search through its archives for the mentions of an alternative book's version.

Jon Forrest· Dec 11, 2018, 17:24 UTC · re: Konstantin Khomoutov · lore

Re: Announcing Pro Git Second Edition Reedited

On 12/11/2018 9:15 AM, Konstantin Khomoutov wrote:
> I think an uspoken issue here is that while you're indeed free to "fork"
> this book and maintain your fork, having two books with almost identical
> contents may not be the best option as it simply may be outright
> confusing for those at whom your fork is actually targeted.
The coverage is almost identical, but the content is different.
Show 5 quoted lines
> That's just my opinion, or — better — feeling I gathered from the
> discussion, but to me these friendly nudges to maybe consider
> reevaluating your work for inclusion into the original's book proper
> look exactly as hints at that having such a fork may not be the best
> of all options.

You might be right, but the reception I got when working on the first edition led me to make the fork. In retrospect, I probably should have tried again with the new crew who did the second edition. As I said, I will try again if there's a third edition.

> Another problem with the fork is its visibility.
> The go-to Git website links to the original work, and I assure you
> novice users do not casually read this list — let alone search through
> its archives for the mentions of an alternative book's version.
I agree, and I don't know what to do about that.
Jon
Robert P. J. Day· Dec 12, 2018, 07:58 UTC · re: Jon Forrest · lore

Re: Announcing Pro Git Second Edition Reedited

On Tue, 11 Dec 2018, Jon Forrest wrote:
Show 24 quoted lines
> On 12/11/2018 2:50 AM, Jeff King wrote:
>
> > The content at https://git-scm.com/book is pulled regularly from
> > https://github.com/progit/progit2, which has collected a number of
> > fixes (as well as translations) since the 2nd edition was
> > released.
> >
> > Have you considered sending some of your edits there? It sounds
> > like they may be too large to just dump as a big PR, but it might
> > be possible to grow together over time.
>
> Fair question. I had tried doing this for the first edition of Pro
> Git, but the person who was in charge of accepting changes wasn't a
> native speaker of English. As a result I had a hard time convincing
> him that my changes were necessary. Many of my changes were very
> subjective, and not technical, so this was hard to overcome. Things
> might have been different if I were correcting technical errors or
> adding significant sections to the book. But, since I'm not a Git
> expert, that's not what I was attempting to do.
>
> Things have changed for the better for the second edition of Pro
> Git. Its management seems much more willing to accept the kind of
> changes I make, as shown by their reaction to the excellent work by
> Robert Day.
  thank ya, thank ya very much. :-) most of my submissions to that
book have been cosmetic -- punctuation, font changes, clarifications
-- and others are to keep up with changes to git. that said, i
definitely have ideas for more wide-ranging changes if i ever get the
time; i think some section re-ordering could be helpful but that's all
in due time.
  i do what i can.
rday
-- 
========================================================================
Robert P. J. Day                                 Ottawa, Ontario, CANADA
                  http://crashcourse.ca/dokuwiki

Twitter:                                       http://twitter.com/rpjday
LinkedIn:                               http://ca.linkedin.com/in/rpjday
========================================================================

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