threads / announce / 22212

[ANNOUNCE] Git wiki & repo.or.cz migration, donations and volunteers pledge

Subject: [ANNOUNCE] Git wiki & repo.or.cz migration, donations and volunteers pledge

## tl;dr

36 messages between Jan 13, 2010 and Feb 12, 2010.

replies: 35people: 10as markdown or json

Petr Baudis· Jan 13, 2010, 23:29 UTC · lore
Hello!

I would like to notify you that unfortunately, Czech UPC terminated the sponsorship of the hardware and connectivity hosting the Git Wiki and repo.or.cz (after generously donating it for several years).

We have just secured at least provisional hosting at the Charles University, Prague and CESNET - the connectivity should be equally good as at UPC, even better on university backbones over the world. However, I will have to buy new rack server for the hosting service from my own pocket and this is where I have to ask for your help - I can't afford to sponsor the full price of the server, and reasonably powerful rack hardware ain't cheap (repo.or.cz _is_ quite a workload!).

Thus, I would like to ask you for donations for the new hardware - the full cost is $1400 (CZK 24000); we would like to gather more in order to be able to buy a RAID0 pair disk and more RAM. Any extra money would all go to the server-related costs, most likely hardware upgrades in the future. I apologize for abusing the vger public forum for this, I hope the readers not using repo.or.cz and the wiki will not mind.

On a related note, unfortunately I can't spend nearly as much time on the wiki and repo.or.cz maintenance and enhancements as it would deserve. Thus, I'm seeking for volunteers to help with both day-to-day maintenance and development. You will be richly credited and ethernal glory in the Git community awaits you, plus it will surely make a great CV bullet-point! :) I'm sure really cool things could be done by developers with fresh ideas, especially after the hardware upgrade.

*** You can donate and view the current pledge status at: ***
	http://repo.or.cz/h/pledge.html
Thanks,
				Petr "Pasky" Baudis
Petr Baudis· Jan 14, 2010, 01:24 UTC · re: Petr Baudis · lore

[RFC] Git Wiki Move

  Hi!
On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 12:29:08AM +0100, Petr Baudis wrote:
> I would like to notify you that unfortunately, Czech UPC terminated the
> sponsorship of the hardware and connectivity hosting the Git Wiki and
> repo.or.cz (after generously donating it for several years).
  ...please scratch the Git Wiki part, you would be supporting just
repo.or.cz - we are considering to move the Git wiki to wiki.kernel.org
MediaWiki installation and I would like to ask if anyone disagrees with
this. The motivation is that:
	(i) wiki.kernel.org is actually maintained! Thus, there should
	be less spam or upgrade issues and better support in case of
	problems.
	(ii) Also, I personally think MediaWiki is so much nicer than
	ikiwiki...
	(iii) ...and OBTW, no CamelCase!
  Of course, there will be compatibility redirects.
  P.S.: Sorry for such hasty mail, I just want to avoid extracting money
from someone on false pretenses. ;-) Let me know if you already sent
some money and wished to support just the wiki.
				Petr "Pasky" Baudis
J.H.· Jan 14, 2010, 10:28 UTC · re: Petr Baudis · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On 01/13/2010 05:24 PM, Petr Baudis wrote:
Show 27 quoted lines
>   Hi!
> 
> On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 12:29:08AM +0100, Petr Baudis wrote:
>> I would like to notify you that unfortunately, Czech UPC terminated the
>> sponsorship of the hardware and connectivity hosting the Git Wiki and
>> repo.or.cz (after generously donating it for several years).
> 
>   ...please scratch the Git Wiki part, you would be supporting just
> repo.or.cz - we are considering to move the Git wiki to wiki.kernel.org
> MediaWiki installation and I would like to ask if anyone disagrees with
> this. The motivation is that:
> 
> 	(i) wiki.kernel.org is actually maintained! Thus, there should
> 	be less spam or upgrade issues and better support in case of
> 	problems.
> 
> 	(ii) Also, I personally think MediaWiki is so much nicer than
> 	ikiwiki...
> 
> 	(iii) ...and OBTW, no CamelCase!
> 
>   Of course, there will be compatibility redirects.
> 
> 
>   P.S.: Sorry for such hasty mail, I just want to avoid extracting money
> from someone on false pretenses. ;-) Let me know if you already sent
> some money and wished to support just the wiki.

Just a heads up I've got an initial import of the current wiki up at http://git.wiki.kernel.org - some of it was quite a clean conversion, some of it not so much. Please note that user accounts were not carried over but edit histories were. I'll work on cleaning up the rest of if tomorrow, assuming that there isn't any objections to Petr's e-mail above. If there is I'm more than happy to drop the wiki if need be, but I figured plowing ahead was reasonably easy and it at least gets the ball rolling.

- John 'Warthog9' Hawley
Matthieu Moy· Jan 14, 2010, 10:35 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

"J.H." <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> writes:
Show 6 quoted lines
> Just a heads up I've got an initial import of the current wiki up at
> http://git.wiki.kernel.org - some of it was quite a clean conversion,
> some of it not so much.  Please note that user accounts were not carried
> over but edit histories were.  I'll work on cleaning up the rest of if
> tomorrow, assuming that there isn't any objections to Petr's e-mail
> above.

My only objection would be "Oh, migrating to another wiki engine will be much conversion work", but if you're willing to do it ;-).

This page seems to be an interesting test-case: http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/GitFaq full of miss-imported formatting, links, ...

-- 
Matthieu Moy
http://www-verimag.imag.fr/~moy/
J.H.· Jan 14, 2010, 18:56 UTC · re: Matthieu Moy · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On 01/14/2010 02:35 AM, Matthieu Moy wrote:
Show 11 quoted lines
> "J.H." <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> writes:
> 
>> Just a heads up I've got an initial import of the current wiki up at
>> http://git.wiki.kernel.org - some of it was quite a clean conversion,
>> some of it not so much.  Please note that user accounts were not carried
>> over but edit histories were.  I'll work on cleaning up the rest of if
>> tomorrow, assuming that there isn't any objections to Petr's e-mail
>> above.
> 
> My only objection would be "Oh, migrating to another wiki engine will
> be much conversion work", but if you're willing to do it ;-).

It unfortunately goes with the territory, though I'll admit the Moinmoin -> Mediawiki was the first conversion I've seen where even Mediawiki said:

	There are a number of hacky scripts for this. They are all
	defective in various ways - anyone who does this job does it
	precisely once, so there's no-one who really maintains a good
	converter script.
> This page seems to be an interesting test-case:
> http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/GitFaq
> full of miss-imported formatting, links, ...
That's not actually the worst,
http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/GitRelatedLogos
even after I've cleaned up a chunk of it is still pretty bad.
- John 'Warthog9' Hawley
J.H.· Jan 15, 2010, 23:18 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Quick update - I think I've got the vast majority of the obvious and simple to correct problems fixed at http://git.wiki.kernel.org anyone want to run through and see if there's anything else that would be considered a show stopper?

I do know that there's some table formatting stuff that I need to look into, but there aren't that many tables on the wiki and those can likely be cleaned by hand now.

- John 'Warthog9' Hawley
Sverre Rabbelier· Jan 15, 2010, 23:21 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Heya,
On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 00:18, J.H. <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> wrote:
> Quick update - I think I've got the vast majority of the obvious and
> simple to correct problems fixed at http://git.wiki.kernel.org anyone
> want to run through and see if there's anything else that would be
> considered a show stopper?

I'd say it's pretty embarassing if our FAQ [0] is broken. Don't have the time to fix it manually atm though :(.

[0] http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/GitFaq
-- 
Cheers,

Sverre Rabbelier
Junio C Hamano· Jan 15, 2010, 23:50 UTC · re: Sverre Rabbelier · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Sverre Rabbelier <srabbelier@gmail.com> writes:
Show 7 quoted lines
> On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 00:18, J.H. <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> wrote:
>> Quick update - I think I've got the vast majority of the obvious and
>> simple to correct problems fixed at http://git.wiki.kernel.org anyone
>> want to run through and see if there's anything else that would be
>> considered a show stopper?
>
> I'd say it's pretty embarassing if our FAQ [0] is broken.

Many "<<GitLink(foobar}}" in the FAQ page do seem like result of mechanical misconversion.

John, thanks for doing this. If people fix things up manually, can they expect their fixes will be kept from now on, iow, the changes will not be overwritten by "Ok, I found a much better mechanical conversion tool and updated with the latest snapshot from the original wiki" in the future?

J.H.· Jan 16, 2010, 00:05 UTC · re: Junio C Hamano · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On 01/15/2010 03:50 PM, Junio C Hamano wrote:
Show 17 quoted lines
> Sverre Rabbelier <srabbelier@gmail.com> writes:
> 
>> On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 00:18, J.H. <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> wrote:
>>> Quick update - I think I've got the vast majority of the obvious and
>>> simple to correct problems fixed at http://git.wiki.kernel.org anyone
>>> want to run through and see if there's anything else that would be
>>> considered a show stopper?
>>
>> I'd say it's pretty embarassing if our FAQ [0] is broken.
> 
> Many "<<GitLink(foobar}}" in the FAQ page do seem like result of
> mechanical misconversion.
> 
> John, thanks for doing this.  If people fix things up manually, can they
> expect their fixes will be kept from now on, iow, the changes will not be
> overwritten by "Ok, I found a much better mechanical conversion tool and
> updated with the latest snapshot from the original wiki" in the future?

I have no intention of re-converting the data, so yes fixups will not be squashed. I've got a small bot script right now that if there's a change that needs to happen pretty universally across the entirety wiki it can be run (it's written in perl, reads in the page text, runs the conversion and re-uploads it), so if there's something that's particularly repetitive people can get me some code that would fix the problem.

So again short answer: I'm at the point where I'd rather clean-up what we've got then try and re-import the data.

- John 'Warthog9' Hawley
J.H.· Jan 16, 2010, 00:02 UTC · re: Sverre Rabbelier · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On 01/15/2010 03:21 PM, Sverre Rabbelier wrote:
Show 12 quoted lines
> Heya,
> 
> On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 00:18, J.H. <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> wrote:
>> Quick update - I think I've got the vast majority of the obvious and
>> simple to correct problems fixed at http://git.wiki.kernel.org anyone
>> want to run through and see if there's anything else that would be
>> considered a show stopper?
> 
> I'd say it's pretty embarassing if our FAQ [0] is broken. Don't have
> the time to fix it manually atm though :(.
> 
> [0] http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/GitFaq

If you can be more specific I can go through and fix it... There's some extraneous bits on the page that I haven't figured out what they were for originally but most everything on the page seems to work fine for me...

Like I said I'm not claiming it's completely 100% accurate in the transition, but for a page that's 144K in size it looks like it's predominantly correct.

- John 'Warthog9' Hawley
Sverre Rabbelier· Jan 16, 2010, 00:08 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Heya,
On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 01:02, J.H. <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> wrote:
> If you can be more specific I can go through and fix it...
>From the original faq:
<<GitLink(git-name, Because Linus is an egotistical git)>>
Is translated to
<<[[GitLink]](git-name, Because Linus is an egotistical git}}
But should instead be turned into a comment (from the source of the faq):
<!-- GitLink[git-name] Because Linus is an egotistical git -->
> There's some
> extraneous bits on the page that I haven't figured out what they were
> for originally but most everything on the page seems to work fine for me...
We're probably referring to the same then :).
-- 
Cheers,

Sverre Rabbelier
Junio C Hamano· Jan 16, 2010, 00:12 UTC · re: Sverre Rabbelier · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Sverre Rabbelier <srabbelier@gmail.com> writes:
Show 17 quoted lines
> From the original faq:
>
> <<GitLink(git-name, Because Linus is an egotistical git)>>
>
> Is translated to
>
> <<[[GitLink]](git-name, Because Linus is an egotistical git}}
>
> But should instead be turned into a comment (from the source of the faq):
>
> <!-- GitLink[git-name] Because Linus is an egotistical git -->
>
>> There's some
>> extraneous bits on the page that I haven't figured out what they were
>> for originally but most everything on the page seems to work fine for me...
>
> We're probably referring to the same then :).

IIRC, they are read by gitbot listening to #git channel at freenode, so that people can say "faq git-name" and such to summon a response.

J.H.· Jan 16, 2010, 00:28 UTC · re: Sverre Rabbelier · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On 01/15/2010 04:08 PM, Sverre Rabbelier wrote:
Show 22 quoted lines
> Heya,
> 
> On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 01:02, J.H. <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> wrote:
>> If you can be more specific I can go through and fix it...
> 
>>From the original faq:
> 
> <<GitLink(git-name, Because Linus is an egotistical git)>>
> 
> Is translated to
> 
> <<[[GitLink]](git-name, Because Linus is an egotistical git}}
> 
> But should instead be turned into a comment (from the source of the faq):
> 
> <!-- GitLink[git-name] Because Linus is an egotistical git -->
> 
>> There's some
>> extraneous bits on the page that I haven't figured out what they were
>> for originally but most everything on the page seems to work fine for me...
> 
> We're probably referring to the same then :).
Probably, should be fixed now, found it on GitBot too.
- John 'Warthog9' Hawley
Sverre Rabbelier· Jan 16, 2010, 00:44 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Heya,
On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 01:28, J.H. <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> wrote:
>> <!-- GitLink[git-name] Because Linus is an egotistical git -->
>
> Probably, should be fixed now, found it on GitBot too.

I guess you removed them rather than turning them in to comments (probably due to MediaWiki's lake of comments)? Works for me, we can figure out something else for gitbot. A regular text file that it can slurp or something. We being Pieter perhaps (as he is the original author)?

-- 
Cheers,

Sverre Rabbelier
J.H.· Jan 16, 2010, 01:18 UTC · re: Sverre Rabbelier · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On 01/15/2010 04:44 PM, Sverre Rabbelier wrote:
Show 12 quoted lines
> Heya,
> 
> On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 01:28, J.H. <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> wrote:
>>> <!-- GitLink[git-name] Because Linus is an egotistical git -->
>>
>> Probably, should be fixed now, found it on GitBot too.
> 
> I guess you removed them rather than turning them in to comments
> (probably due to MediaWiki's lake of comments)? Works for me, we can
> figure out something else for gitbot. A regular text file that it can
> slurp or something. We being Pieter perhaps (as he is the original author)?
>

The templates giving me a PITA trying to get it to actually generate a comment, easiest thing might be to hide it in the span or something, or add the comments in manually.

- John 'Warthog9' Hawley
Clemens Buchacher· Jan 16, 2010, 10:17 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On Fri, Jan 15, 2010 at 05:18:53PM -0800, J.H. wrote:
Show 16 quoted lines
> On 01/15/2010 04:44 PM, Sverre Rabbelier wrote:
> > On Sat, Jan 16, 2010 at 01:28, J.H. <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> wrote:
> >>> <!-- GitLink[git-name] Because Linus is an egotistical git -->
> >>
> >> Probably, should be fixed now, found it on GitBot too.
> > 
> > I guess you removed them rather than turning them in to comments
> > (probably due to MediaWiki's lake of comments)? Works for me, we can
> > figure out something else for gitbot. A regular text file that it can
> > slurp or something. We being Pieter perhaps (as he is the original author)?
> > 
> 
> The templates giving me a PITA trying to get it to actually generate a
> comment, easiest thing might be to hide it in the span or something, or
> add the comments in manually.
>

While we are at it, it would be good to put gitlink's past the section name, so that it is available when using section editing (the lack of which was a huge PITA in moinmoin).

Also, it would be better to actually show the gitlink name and comment with the regular content. Maybe using a special tag which makes it look like a comment. For example

 == Why won't I see changes in the remote repo after "git push"? ==
 {{gitlink|non-bare|Pushing to non-bare repositories is discouraged}}
which gets translated to
 <div id="contentSub">
  non-bare -- Pushing to non-bare repositories is discouraged
 </div>
Clemens
Matthieu Moy· Jan 17, 2010, 12:00 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

"J.H." <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> writes:
> Quick update - I think I've got the vast majority of the obvious and
> simple to correct problems fixed at http://git.wiki.kernel.org anyone
> want to run through and see if there's anything else that would be
> considered a show stopper?

The main page is locked, and there are some broken links formatting in the News section: http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Main_Page#News I'm user "Moy" there if you want to let me fix them.

You should set $wgLogo to some Git logo, among http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/GitRelatedLogos

You can also add a few links to the sidebar, by editting: http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/MediaWiki:Sidebar

(it seems I don't have permission to do it myself). I suggest taking the ones of the front-page:

* Starting points
** Installation|Installation
** InterfacesFrontendsAndTools|Git Tools
** GitDocumentation|Git Documentation
** GitCommunity|Git Community Support
** GitProjects|Projects using Git
** GitFaq|FAQ
** GitHosting|Git Hosting
** GitLinks|Git Links
** GitComparison|Git Compared
-- 
Matthieu Moy
http://www-verimag.imag.fr/~moy/
Johannes Schindelin· Jan 17, 2010, 23:06 UTC · re: Matthieu Moy · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Hi,
On Sun, 17 Jan 2010, Matthieu Moy wrote:
Show 10 quoted lines
> "J.H." <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> writes:
> 
> > Quick update - I think I've got the vast majority of the obvious and
> > simple to correct problems fixed at http://git.wiki.kernel.org anyone
> > want to run through and see if there's anything else that would be
> > considered a show stopper?
> 
> The main page is locked, and there are some broken links formatting in
> the News section: http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Main_Page#News
> I'm user "Moy" there if you want to let me fix them.
I think I managed to edit them.
> You should set $wgLogo to some Git logo, among
> http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/GitRelatedLogos

Best would be the standard one: http://git.or.cz/git-logo.png but I would actually also like http://henrik.nyh.se/uploads/git-logo.png.

> You can also add a few links to the sidebar, by editting:
> http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/MediaWiki:Sidebar
> 
> (it seems I don't have permission to do it myself).

You need to be in the Sysop list to do so. Warthog, if you trust me :-) would you mind adding me to that group? You can do that by visiting

http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Special:Userrights
when you are a sysop.
Show 12 quoted lines
> I suggest taking the ones of the front-page:
> 
> * Starting points
> ** Installation|Installation
> ** InterfacesFrontendsAndTools|Git Tools
> ** GitDocumentation|Git Documentation
> ** GitCommunity|Git Community Support
> ** GitProjects|Projects using Git
> ** GitFaq|FAQ
> ** GitHosting|Git Hosting
> ** GitLinks|Git Links
> ** GitComparison|Git Compared
Let's not forget
* navigation
** mainpage|mainpage-description
** recentchanges-url|recentchanges
** randompage-url|randompage
** helppage|help
* SEARCH
* TOOLBOX

BTW there is a file KHTMLFixes.css in the directory skins/monobook/ which makes the layout break with Chromium. Apparently, it is no longer needed by KHTML anyway. So could you please replace that file with an empty one, or comment out the offending part, like so:

	/* #column-content { margin-left: 0; } */

Thank you, Dscho

J.H.· Jan 18, 2010, 00:43 UTC · re: Johannes Schindelin · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On 01/17/2010 03:06 PM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
Show 16 quoted lines
> Hi,
> 
> On Sun, 17 Jan 2010, Matthieu Moy wrote:
> 
>> "J.H." <warthog19@eaglescrag.net> writes:
>>
>>> Quick update - I think I've got the vast majority of the obvious and
>>> simple to correct problems fixed at http://git.wiki.kernel.org anyone
>>> want to run through and see if there's anything else that would be
>>> considered a show stopper?
>>
>> The main page is locked, and there are some broken links formatting in
>> the News section: http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Main_Page#News
>> I'm user "Moy" there if you want to let me fix them.
> 
> I think I managed to edit them.

You have to have a confirmed e-mail account to be able to edit anything, the errors on why you can't edit are fairly straight forward.

Show 6 quoted lines
> 
>> You should set $wgLogo to some Git logo, among
>> http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/GitRelatedLogos
> 
> Best would be the standard one: http://git.or.cz/git-logo.png but I would 
> actually also like http://henrik.nyh.se/uploads/git-logo.png.

I'd leave that up to the greater community. The second one there would fit better on the page honestly, but I don't want to go making a logo decision for the entirety of the project.

Show 12 quoted lines
> 
>> You can also add a few links to the sidebar, by editting:
>> http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/MediaWiki:Sidebar
>>
>> (it seems I don't have permission to do it myself).
> 
> You need to be in the Sysop list to do so.  Warthog, if you trust me :-) 
> would you mind adding me to that group?  You can do that by visiting
> 
> http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Special:Userrights
> 
> when you are a sysop.
Done.
Show 30 quoted lines
> 
>> I suggest taking the ones of the front-page:
>>
>> * Starting points
>> ** Installation|Installation
>> ** InterfacesFrontendsAndTools|Git Tools
>> ** GitDocumentation|Git Documentation
>> ** GitCommunity|Git Community Support
>> ** GitProjects|Projects using Git
>> ** GitFaq|FAQ
>> ** GitHosting|Git Hosting
>> ** GitLinks|Git Links
>> ** GitComparison|Git Compared
> 
> Let's not forget
> 
> * navigation
> ** mainpage|mainpage-description
> ** recentchanges-url|recentchanges
> ** randompage-url|randompage
> ** helppage|help
> * SEARCH
> * TOOLBOX
> 
> BTW there is a file KHTMLFixes.css in the directory skins/monobook/ which 
> makes the layout break with Chromium.  Apparently, it is no longer needed 
> by KHTML anyway.  So could you please replace that file with an empty one, 
> or comment out the offending part, like so:
> 
> 	/* #column-content { margin-left: 0; } */

I'm not keen on making changes since that file is still coming from the shipping version of mediawiki and I'm trying, quite a lot, to not run a modified version of it. I've got enough troubles with the fact that that one change would affect 22 wikis in a single go.

As bad as it is to say this, I'd rather wait for 1.16 to come out vs. modify it in place. Mediawiki is claiming they are in continuous integration development with quarterly releases but their last release was June of 2009, so take that as you will.

- John 'Warthog9' Hawley
Johannes Schindelin· Jan 18, 2010, 09:53 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Hi,
On Sun, 17 Jan 2010, J.H. wrote:
Show 13 quoted lines
> On 01/17/2010 03:06 PM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> 
> > On Sun, 17 Jan 2010, Matthieu Moy wrote:
> > 
> >> You should set $wgLogo to some Git logo, among 
> >> http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/GitRelatedLogos
> > 
> > Best would be the standard one: http://git.or.cz/git-logo.png but I 
> > would actually also like http://henrik.nyh.se/uploads/git-logo.png.
> 
> I'd leave that up to the greater community.  The second one there would 
> fit better on the page honestly, but I don't want to go making a logo 
> decision for the entirety of the project.

Why not set the logo to the second one, and at the same time start one of our famous bikeshedding fests? (Anyone answering to that question, please change the subject to "Wiki logo".)

Show 13 quoted lines
> >> You can also add a few links to the sidebar, by editting: 
> >> http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/MediaWiki:Sidebar
> >>
> >> (it seems I don't have permission to do it myself).
> > 
> > You need to be in the Sysop list to do so.  Warthog, if you trust me :-) 
> > would you mind adding me to that group?  You can do that by visiting
> > 
> > http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/Special:Userrights
> > 
> > when you are a sysop.
> 
> Done.
Thank you very much!
Show 22 quoted lines
> >> I suggest taking the ones of the front-page:
> >>
> >> * Starting points
> >> ** Installation|Installation
> >> ** InterfacesFrontendsAndTools|Git Tools
> >> ** GitDocumentation|Git Documentation
> >> ** GitCommunity|Git Community Support
> >> ** GitProjects|Projects using Git
> >> ** GitFaq|FAQ
> >> ** GitHosting|Git Hosting
> >> ** GitLinks|Git Links
> >> ** GitComparison|Git Compared
> > 
> > Let's not forget
> > 
> > * navigation
> > ** mainpage|mainpage-description
> > ** recentchanges-url|recentchanges
> > ** randompage-url|randompage
> > ** helppage|help
> > * SEARCH
> > * TOOLBOX
Changed as suggested.
Show 16 quoted lines
> > BTW there is a file KHTMLFixes.css in the directory skins/monobook/ 
> > which makes the layout break with Chromium.  Apparently, it is no 
> > longer needed by KHTML anyway.  So could you please replace that file 
> > with an empty one, or comment out the offending part, like so:
> > 
> > 	/* #column-content { margin-left: 0; } */
> 
> I'm not keen on making changes since that file is still coming from the
> shipping version of mediawiki and I'm trying, quite a lot, to not run a
> modified version of it.  I've got enough troubles with the fact that
> that one change would affect 22 wikis in a single go.
> 
> As bad as it is to say this, I'd rather wait for 1.16 to come out vs. 
> modify it in place.  Mediawiki is claiming they are in continuous 
> integration development with quarterly releases but their last release 
> was June of 2009, so take that as you will.

Fair enough. As long as Chromium has a fairly small share of the market, I think it is safe to tell everybody to wait a little until the side bar is no longer displayed at the left _below_ the main body text. AFAICT the problem was solved with Wikipedia, so the next release should magically fix the issue.

Thanks, Dscho

Johannes Schindelin· Jan 18, 2010, 12:03 UTC · re: Johannes Schindelin · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Hi,
On Mon, 18 Jan 2010, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
Show 26 quoted lines
> On Sun, 17 Jan 2010, J.H. wrote:
> 
> > On 01/17/2010 03:06 PM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> > 
> > > BTW there is a file KHTMLFixes.css in the directory skins/monobook/ 
> > > which makes the layout break with Chromium.  Apparently, it is no 
> > > longer needed by KHTML anyway.  So could you please replace that 
> > > file with an empty one, or comment out the offending part, like so:
> > > 
> > > 	/* #column-content { margin-left: 0; } */
> > 
> > I'm not keen on making changes since that file is still coming from 
> > the shipping version of mediawiki and I'm trying, quite a lot, to not 
> > run a modified version of it.  I've got enough troubles with the fact 
> > that that one change would affect 22 wikis in a single go.
> > 
> > As bad as it is to say this, I'd rather wait for 1.16 to come out vs. 
> > modify it in place.  Mediawiki is claiming they are in continuous 
> > integration development with quarterly releases but their last release 
> > was June of 2009, so take that as you will.
> 
> Fair enough.  As long as Chromium has a fairly small share of the 
> market, I think it is safe to tell everybody to wait a little until the 
> side bar is no longer displayed at the left _below_ the main body text.  
> AFAICT the problem was solved with Wikipedia, so the next release should 
> magically fix the issue.

Actually, in a rare case of cleverness, I found out how to fix it (at least for me, it works):

	http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/MediaWiki:Monobook.css

Of course, this is only a work-around, and it will get broken once Monobook changes dimensions (or more). But hopefully Chromium will be fixed by then, extending the canvas into the negative arm of the x axis whenever needed. And then I will happily delete the custom Monobook.css.

These are the things left that I would like to see soon:
- add a link from the old Wiki (with rewrite rules)
- use whatever logo (anything is better than the sunflower)
- enable anonymous edits
- a major cleanup of the broken autolinks and faulty formatting.

The latter point is probably the most tedious one, so I suggest that only those get a vote on the logo who fix at least 3 pages.

Ciao, Dscho

J.H.· Jan 18, 2010, 18:47 UTC · re: Johannes Schindelin · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On 01/18/2010 04:03 AM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
Show 40 quoted lines
> Hi,
> 
> On Mon, 18 Jan 2010, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> 
>> On Sun, 17 Jan 2010, J.H. wrote:
>>
>>> On 01/17/2010 03:06 PM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
>>>
>>>> BTW there is a file KHTMLFixes.css in the directory skins/monobook/ 
>>>> which makes the layout break with Chromium.  Apparently, it is no 
>>>> longer needed by KHTML anyway.  So could you please replace that 
>>>> file with an empty one, or comment out the offending part, like so:
>>>>
>>>> 	/* #column-content { margin-left: 0; } */
>>>
>>> I'm not keen on making changes since that file is still coming from 
>>> the shipping version of mediawiki and I'm trying, quite a lot, to not 
>>> run a modified version of it.  I've got enough troubles with the fact 
>>> that that one change would affect 22 wikis in a single go.
>>>
>>> As bad as it is to say this, I'd rather wait for 1.16 to come out vs. 
>>> modify it in place.  Mediawiki is claiming they are in continuous 
>>> integration development with quarterly releases but their last release 
>>> was June of 2009, so take that as you will.
>>
>> Fair enough.  As long as Chromium has a fairly small share of the 
>> market, I think it is safe to tell everybody to wait a little until the 
>> side bar is no longer displayed at the left _below_ the main body text.  
>> AFAICT the problem was solved with Wikipedia, so the next release should 
>> magically fix the issue.
> 
> Actually, in a rare case of cleverness, I found out how to fix it (at 
> least for me, it works):
> 
> 	http://git.wiki.kernel.org/index.php/MediaWiki:Monobook.css
> 
> Of course, this is only a work-around, and it will get broken once 
> Monobook changes dimensions (or more).  But hopefully Chromium will be 
> fixed by then, extending the canvas into the negative arm of the x axis 
> whenever needed.  And then I will happily delete the custom Monobook.css.
That works.
> These are the things left that I would like to see soon:
> 
> - add a link from the old Wiki (with rewrite rules)

I think the rewrites should be simple enough (the pages seem to line up 1:1 easily enough) so all I would need to do is discuss this with Petr.

> - use whatever logo (anything is better than the sunflower)
It's easy enough to change just need to know which one to use.
> - enable anonymous edits

Anonymous edits will *NEVER* be enabled. You are going to need to have an account and your going to have to verify it's e-mail to be able to do eits. Completely anonymous edits are too much of a risk considering bots and spam and the abuse they can do.

Even then there is at least one case of a spammer actually going through and using a verified account.

> - a major cleanup of the broken autolinks and faulty formatting.
> 
> The latter point is probably the most tedious one, so I suggest that only 
> those get a vote on the logo who fix at least 3 pages.
sound fair to me.
- John 'Warthog9' Hawley
Johannes Schindelin· Jan 18, 2010, 20:46 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Hi,
On Mon, 18 Jan 2010, J.H. wrote:
Show 8 quoted lines
> On 01/18/2010 04:03 AM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> 
> > These are the things left that I would like to see soon:
> > 
> > - add a link from the old Wiki (with rewrite rules)
> 
> I think the rewrites should be simple enough (the pages seem to line up 
> 1:1 easily enough) so all I would need to do is discuss this with Petr.
Wonderful.
> > - use whatever logo (anything is better than the sunflower)
> 
> It's easy enough to change just need to know which one to use.
See below.
Show 9 quoted lines
> > - enable anonymous edits
> 
> Anonymous edits will *NEVER* be enabled.  You are going to need to have
> an account and your going to have to verify it's e-mail to be able to do
> eits.  Completely anonymous edits are too much of a risk considering
> bots and spam and the abuse they can do.
> 
> Even then there is at least one case of a spammer actually going through
> and using a verified account.

That's good news. Every couple of days I would look through the recent changes, and sadly enough, there were many spammings on the GitWiki. No more!

Show 6 quoted lines
> > - a major cleanup of the broken autolinks and faulty formatting.
> > 
> > The latter point is probably the most tedious one, so I suggest that 
> > only those get a vote on the logo who fix at least 3 pages.
> 
> sound fair to me.

I think I qualify. My vote goes for http://henrik.nyh.se/uploads/git-logo.png, as it is really pretty. If you agree, and put in your vote, too, you can already set it until the bikeshedding has settled down ;-)

Ciao, Dscho

Petr Baudis· Jan 21, 2010, 21:35 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On Mon, Jan 18, 2010 at 10:47:25AM -0800, J.H. wrote:
Show 5 quoted lines
> On 01/18/2010 04:03 AM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> > - add a link from the old Wiki (with rewrite rules)
> 
> I think the rewrites should be simple enough (the pages seem to line up
> 1:1 easily enough) so all I would need to do is discuss this with Petr.

repo.or.cz migration to new server is now finished and on the new system, I chose to not even install moinwiki at all. Instead, I've installed a rewrite rule so all http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/ accesses are sent to the appropriate place of http://git.wiki.kernel.org/ - thus, that's the master copy of git wiki now. :-) Thanks a lot for stepping up to do this, J.H.!

-- 
				Petr "Pasky" Baudis
A lot of people have my books on their bookshelves.
That's the problem, they need to read them. -- Don Knuth
Jakub Narebski· Jan 22, 2010, 00:21 UTC · re: Petr Baudis · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Petr Baudis <pasky@suse.cz> writes:
> On Mon, Jan 18, 2010 at 10:47:25AM -0800, J.H. wrote:
> > On 01/18/2010 04:03 AM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
Show 10 quoted lines
> > > - add a link from the old Wiki (with rewrite rules)
> > 
> > I think the rewrites should be simple enough (the pages seem to line up
> > 1:1 easily enough) so all I would need to do is discuss this with Petr.
> 
> repo.or.cz migration to new server is now finished and on the new
> system, I chose to not even install moinwiki at all. Instead, I've
> installed a rewrite rule so all http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/ accesses are
> sent to the appropriate place of http://git.wiki.kernel.org/ - thus,
> that's the master copy of git wiki now. :-)

Are all formatting bugs from MoinMoin + media4moin -> MediaWiki fixed? If not, then it would be good to have reference read-only copy of old MoinMoin-based wiki to compare against.

> Thanks a lot for stepping up to do this, J.H.!
-- 
Jakub Narebski
Poland
ShadeHawk on #git
Petr Baudis· Jan 22, 2010, 00:31 UTC · re: Jakub Narebski · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 04:21:22PM -0800, Jakub Narebski wrote:
Show 18 quoted lines
> Petr Baudis <pasky@suse.cz> writes:
> > On Mon, Jan 18, 2010 at 10:47:25AM -0800, J.H. wrote:
> > > On 01/18/2010 04:03 AM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> 
> > > > - add a link from the old Wiki (with rewrite rules)
> > > 
> > > I think the rewrites should be simple enough (the pages seem to line up
> > > 1:1 easily enough) so all I would need to do is discuss this with Petr.
> > 
> > repo.or.cz migration to new server is now finished and on the new
> > system, I chose to not even install moinwiki at all. Instead, I've
> > installed a rewrite rule so all http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/ accesses are
> > sent to the appropriate place of http://git.wiki.kernel.org/ - thus,
> > that's the master copy of git wiki now. :-) 
> 
> Are all formatting bugs from MoinMoin + media4moin -> MediaWiki fixed?
> If not, then it would be good to have reference read-only copy of old
> MoinMoin-based wiki to compare against.

I'm not sure about the current state, I didn't really have time to look carefully, so if people will say they have concrete need for the reference read-only copy, I will set it up. But with the local hacks and completely new system, it won't be trivial, so I'd prefer not to do it just proactively.

				Petr "Pasky" Baudis
Johannes Schindelin· Jan 22, 2010, 00:39 UTC · re: Jakub Narebski · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Hi,
On Thu, 21 Jan 2010, Jakub Narebski wrote:
Show 16 quoted lines
> Petr Baudis <pasky@suse.cz> writes:
> > On Mon, Jan 18, 2010 at 10:47:25AM -0800, J.H. wrote:
> > > On 01/18/2010 04:03 AM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> 
> > > > - add a link from the old Wiki (with rewrite rules)
> > > 
> > > I think the rewrites should be simple enough (the pages seem to line up
> > > 1:1 easily enough) so all I would need to do is discuss this with Petr.
> > 
> > repo.or.cz migration to new server is now finished and on the new
> > system, I chose to not even install moinwiki at all. Instead, I've
> > installed a rewrite rule so all http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/ accesses are
> > sent to the appropriate place of http://git.wiki.kernel.org/ - thus,
> > that's the master copy of git wiki now. :-) 
> 
> Are all formatting bugs from MoinMoin + media4moin -> MediaWiki fixed?

No. The big ones are GitSurvey pages (except for 2007) and the SoC pages. I went through all others, which means that maybe the occasional bug slipped through, but basically the pages are sound.

Which makes me think that I finally deserve to see Henrik Nyh's logo on the Wiki.

> If not, then it would be good to have reference read-only copy of old
> MoinMoin-based wiki to compare against.

If it would not involve more work for Pasky, I would agree. But mainly the work was done.

Ciao, Dscho

Johannes Schindelin· Jan 14, 2010, 10:43 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Hi,
On Thu, 14 Jan 2010, J.H. wrote:
Show 17 quoted lines
> On 01/13/2010 05:24 PM, Petr Baudis wrote:
> 
> > On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 12:29:08AM +0100, Petr Baudis wrote:
> >> I would like to notify you that unfortunately, Czech UPC terminated 
> >> the sponsorship of the hardware and connectivity hosting the Git Wiki 
> >> and repo.or.cz (after generously donating it for several years).
> > 
> >   ...please scratch the Git Wiki part, you would be supporting just 
> > repo.or.cz - we are considering to move the Git wiki to 
> > wiki.kernel.org MediaWiki installation and I would like to ask if 
> > anyone disagrees with this. The motivation is that:
> > 
> > 	(i) wiki.kernel.org is actually maintained! Thus, there should be 
> > 	less spam or upgrade issues and better support in case of problems.
> > 
> > 	(ii) Also, I personally think MediaWiki is so much nicer than 
> > 	ikiwiki...
... not to mention than MoinMoin...
Show 7 quoted lines
> > 	(iii) ...and OBTW, no CamelCase!
> > 
> >   Of course, there will be compatibility redirects.
> 
> Just a heads up I've got an initial import of the current wiki up at
> http://git.wiki.kernel.org - some of it was quite a clean conversion,
> some of it not so much.

Did you use a script? And did you leech the sources, or did you get a dump?

I note that "<<<!-- ! TOC here -->(2)>>" could be converted to "__TOC__", I believe.

> Please note that user accounts were not carried over but edit histories 
> were.

IIUC there are no email addresses stored in the Git Wiki, so I think that we'll have to live with that. You might get the occasional complaint of a stolen account.

> I'll work on cleaning up the rest of if tomorrow, assuming that there 
> isn't any objections to Petr's e-mail above.

I like it. Especially since there is a fun project waiting for me to get some time to do it, to convert the full history of a MediaWiki instance into a Git repository. Maybe via the git-remote* mechanism, once Sverre and Ilari manage to flush out the last remnants of clumsy design.

Ciao, Dscho

Johannes Schindelin· Jan 14, 2010, 11:01 UTC · re: Johannes Schindelin · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Hi,
On Thu, 14 Jan 2010, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
> I note that "<<<!-- ! TOC here -->(2)>>" could be converted to 
> "__TOC__", I believe.

Several more things: external links only take single brackets, the separator between URL and text is a space, not a pipe symbol, and you have to translate brackets in link texts to &#91; and &#93; respectively (see my test edits on your Wiki).

Likewise, <<BR>> in MoinMoin is <BR> in MediaWiki (the case actually does not matter).

Probably it would also be good to inform the author of the gitbot on #git of the change. Was it 'pieter'?

Ciao, Dscho

J.H.· Jan 14, 2010, 18:52 UTC · re: Johannes Schindelin · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On 01/14/2010 02:43 AM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:
Show 34 quoted lines
> Hi,
> 
> On Thu, 14 Jan 2010, J.H. wrote:
> 
>> On 01/13/2010 05:24 PM, Petr Baudis wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 12:29:08AM +0100, Petr Baudis wrote:
>>>> I would like to notify you that unfortunately, Czech UPC terminated 
>>>> the sponsorship of the hardware and connectivity hosting the Git Wiki 
>>>> and repo.or.cz (after generously donating it for several years).
>>>
>>>   ...please scratch the Git Wiki part, you would be supporting just 
>>> repo.or.cz - we are considering to move the Git wiki to 
>>> wiki.kernel.org MediaWiki installation and I would like to ask if 
>>> anyone disagrees with this. The motivation is that:
>>>
>>> 	(i) wiki.kernel.org is actually maintained! Thus, there should be 
>>> 	less spam or upgrade issues and better support in case of problems.
>>>
>>> 	(ii) Also, I personally think MediaWiki is so much nicer than 
>>> 	ikiwiki...
> 
> ... not to mention than MoinMoin...
> 
>>> 	(iii) ...and OBTW, no CamelCase!
>>>
>>>   Of course, there will be compatibility redirects.
>>
>> Just a heads up I've got an initial import of the current wiki up at
>> http://git.wiki.kernel.org - some of it was quite a clean conversion,
>> some of it not so much.
> 
> Did you use a script?  And did you leech the sources, or did you get a 
> dump?

Used a conversion script form a dump from Petr, needless to say it wa sthe one generally recommended by mediawiki and even their commentary on it was "It's the least bad" basically

> I note that "<<<!-- ! TOC here -->(2)>>" could be converted to "__TOC__", 
> I believe.

I'll have to go in behind and track those down, should be easy enough to find / fix.

Show 6 quoted lines
>> Please note that user accounts were not carried over but edit histories 
>> were.
> 
> IIUC there are no email addresses stored in the Git Wiki, so I think that 
> we'll have to live with that.  You might get the occasional complaint of a 
> stolen account.

I'm fine with dealing with those on an individual basis, and it would be good for people to re-create their accounts as soon as possible.

Show 7 quoted lines
>> I'll work on cleaning up the rest of if tomorrow, assuming that there 
>> isn't any objections to Petr's e-mail above.
> 
> I like it.  Especially since there is a fun project waiting for me to 
> get some time to do it, to convert the full history of a MediaWiki 
> instance into a Git repository.  Maybe via the git-remote* mechanism, once 
> Sverre and Ilari manage to flush out the last remnants of clumsy design.
Now you've got a solid wiki to work with that's pertinent ;-)
- John 'Warthog9' Hawley
Petr Baudis· Jan 14, 2010, 10:48 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 02:28:48AM -0800, J.H. wrote:
Show 6 quoted lines
> Just a heads up I've got an initial import of the current wiki up at
> http://git.wiki.kernel.org - some of it was quite a clean conversion,
> some of it not so much.  Please note that user accounts were not carried
> over but edit histories were.  I'll work on cleaning up the rest of if
> tomorrow, assuming that there isn't any objections to Petr's e-mail
> above.

Are you going to do a lot of manual work there? Since I haven't disabled editing the current wiki yet, so maybe I should already do that... (If I can figure out how. ;-)

				Petr "Pasky" Baudis
Johannes Schindelin· Jan 14, 2010, 11:03 UTC · re: Petr Baudis · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Hi,
On Thu, 14 Jan 2010, Petr Baudis wrote:
Show 11 quoted lines
> On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 02:28:48AM -0800, J.H. wrote:
> > Just a heads up I've got an initial import of the current wiki up at 
> > http://git.wiki.kernel.org - some of it was quite a clean conversion, 
> > some of it not so much.  Please note that user accounts were not 
> > carried over but edit histories were.  I'll work on cleaning up the 
> > rest of if tomorrow, assuming that there isn't any objections to 
> > Petr's e-mail above.
> 
> Are you going to do a lot of manual work there? Since I haven't disabled 
> editing the current wiki yet, so maybe I should already do that... (If I 
> can figure out how. ;-)

It would be good: I just verified that warthog imported everything up to and including the latest 4 changes on January 12.

Ciao, Dscho

Petr Baudis· Feb 12, 2010, 11:38 UTC · re: J.H. · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 02:28:48AM -0800, J.H. wrote:
Show 8 quoted lines
> Just a heads up I've got an initial import of the current wiki up at
> http://git.wiki.kernel.org - some of it was quite a clean conversion,
> some of it not so much.  Please note that user accounts were not carried
> over but edit histories were.  I'll work on cleaning up the rest of if
> tomorrow, assuming that there isn't any objections to Petr's e-mail
> above.  If there is I'm more than happy to drop the wiki if need be, but
> I figured plowing ahead was reasonably easy and it at least gets the
> ball rolling.
  It seems that there is no page in the Help: namespace, could you
please add the generic help pages there? (If that's the way it works
in MediaWiki...) I used to be hyper-active wikipedia editor, but that
times passed long ago and my memory got rusty.
  Thanks,
-- 
				Petr "Pasky" Baudis
A great many people think they are thinking when they are merely
rearranging their prejudices. -- William James
Wincent Colaiuta· Jan 14, 2010, 10:48 UTC · re: Petr Baudis · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

El 14/01/2010, a las 02:24, Petr Baudis escribió:
Show 6 quoted lines
> 	(i) wiki.kernel.org is actually maintained! Thus, there should
> 	be less spam or upgrade issues and better support in case of
> 	problems.
>
> 	(ii) Also, I personally think MediaWiki is so much nicer than
> 	ikiwiki...
+1 for MediaWiki.

Cheers, Wincent

Joey Hess· Jan 15, 2010, 17:17 UTC · re: Petr Baudis · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Petr Baudis wrote:
> 	(ii) Also, I personally think MediaWiki is so much nicer than
> 	ikiwiki...

This seems like a non-sequitor, since the git wiki is not using, and afaik, has never used ikiwiki.

-- 
see shy jo, author of ikiwiki, though not of its excellent git backend :-P
Johannes Schindelin· Jan 15, 2010, 19:16 UTC · re: Joey Hess · lore

Re: [RFC] Git Wiki Move

Hi,
On Fri, 15 Jan 2010, Joey Hess wrote:
Show 6 quoted lines
> Petr Baudis wrote:
> > 	(ii) Also, I personally think MediaWiki is so much nicer than
> > 	ikiwiki...
> 
> This seems like a non-sequitor, since the git wiki is not using, and
> afaik, has never used ikiwiki.

It was using MoinMoin, but of course there were thoughts of migrating to something that uses Git as a backend.

This comment is most likely Pasky's attempt to explain why this is not going to happen, and I agree with the decision (not that I have much say there).

Ciao, Dscho

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