threads / discuss / 29258

GIT and SSH

Subject: GIT and SSH

## tl;dr

7 messages between Dec 28, 2011 and Dec 29, 2011.

replies: 6people: 5as markdown or json

Reza Mostafid· Dec 28, 2011, 08:43 UTC · lore

I am starting to use GIT and I would be grateful for a simple answer to a specific situation to help me find the right ball-park.

a.) Does the communication that takes place between a GIT `client` and a remote
    GIT `repository` involve 'ssh' traffic?

Our connections here are heavily censored and ssh traffic is suppressed most of the time which is why I need to figure out why a simple

    $ git clone git://<URL> 
command chokes to a halt and freezes most of the time ( the same command when
executed remotely on our V.P.S. in Europe works flawlessly ).
 
b.) Are there means to make the `git` client on my machine circumvent this?
Y/N answers or brief hints to my questions suffice, I'll work out the rest. 

Basically I would like to know whether there is a point at all trying to make git work from where I am, given the limitations mentioned.

Regards
Reza
Dov Grobgeld· Dec 28, 2011, 09:55 UTC · re: Reza Mostafid · lore

Re: GIT and SSH

Git supports multiple transport protocols. Among them are git, ssh, and https. (You can also use direct file system access, but it is questionable whether to call that a protocol). Each of the protocols have their advantages and drawbacks. The git protocol is only used for reading, and not for writing, but is supposed to be very fast. The common firewall filtering of the git protocol port 9418 is another problem. ssh is the prefered protocol for writing to a remote protocol. But if ssh is filtered, then http/https may be used, which is very slow for large repositories, but it has the advantage that it is the least blocked protocol.

For more info see:
    http://progit.org/book/ch4-1.html

Regards, Dov

On Wed, Dec 28, 2011 at 10:43, Reza Mostafid <m.r.mostafid@gmail.com> wrote:
Show 33 quoted lines
> I am starting to use GIT and I would be grateful for a simple answer to a
> specific situation to help me find the right ball-park.
>
>
> a.) Does the communication that takes place between a GIT `client` and a remote
>    GIT `repository` involve 'ssh' traffic?
>
>
> Our connections here are heavily censored and ssh traffic is suppressed most of
> the time which is why I need to figure out why a simple
>
>    $ git clone git://<URL>
>
> command chokes to a halt and freezes most of the time ( the same command when
> executed remotely on our V.P.S. in Europe works flawlessly ).
>
>
> b.) Are there means to make the `git` client on my machine circumvent this?
>
>
> Y/N answers or brief hints to my questions suffice, I'll work out the rest.
>
> Basically I would like to know whether there is a point at all trying to make
> git work from where I am, given the limitations mentioned.
>
> Regards
>
> Reza
>
> --
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe git" in
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> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Carlos Martín Nieto· Dec 28, 2011, 10:15 UTC · re: Dov Grobgeld · lore

Re: GIT and SSH

On Wed, Dec 28, 2011 at 11:55:24AM +0200, Dov Grobgeld wrote:
Show 10 quoted lines
> Git supports multiple transport protocols. Among them are git, ssh,
> and https. (You can also use direct file system access, but it is
> questionable whether to call that a protocol). Each of the protocols
> have their advantages and drawbacks. The git protocol is only used for
> reading, and not for writing, but is supposed to be very fast. The
> common firewall filtering of the git protocol port 9418 is another
> problem. ssh is the prefered protocol for writing to a remote
> protocol. But if ssh is filtered, then http/https may be used, which
> is very slow for large repositories, but it has the advantage that it
> is the least blocked protocol.

Slow for large repositories? Are you thinking of the dumb HTTP transport? That one shouldn't be used for doing any serious work. The Smart HTTP transport is just the git smart protocol (the same one git:// and ssh:// URLs speak) wrapped inside HTTP communication. The negotiation phase is a more expensive than with either git or ssh, as HTTP is stateless and you need to remind the remote what you want and what you've already agreed on, but the actual transfer of data is done the same way than with the others so overall it shouldn't be that noticeable.

Now, to the OP's concerns: yes, the ssh transport does generate ssh transport, as that's the whole point. You authenticate against the remote machine's ssh daemon and run git-upload-pack or git-receive-pack as needed (for fetching or pushing). If corporate policy doesn't allow ssh you should either fix the policy or use the smart HTTP protocol, though this involves messing with passwords and their associated problems. I'm not saying ssh keys don't have their complications, but I much prefer them.

We can't help you diagnose why your clone is stalling without more information. It could be that the connection between the computers is flaky, git trying to take too much memory on the remote or local machines or any number of things. See if setting GIT_TRACE=1 in the environment helps to see what's going on.

   cmn
Jakub Narebski· Dec 28, 2011, 11:02 UTC · re: Carlos Martín Nieto · lore

Re: GIT and SSH

Carlos Martín Nieto <cmn@elego.de> writes:
> On Wed, Dec 28, 2011 at 11:55:24AM +0200, Dov Grobgeld wrote:
Show 5 quoted lines
> > Git supports multiple transport protocols. Among them are git, ssh,
> > and https. (You can also use direct file system access, but it is
> > questionable whether to call that a protocol). Each of the protocols
> > have their advantages and drawbacks. The git protocol is only used for
> > reading, and not for writing, but is supposed to be very fast. The

FYI git:// protocol can theoretically be used for pushing, but it is not recommended because git:// protocol is not authenthicated - that is why you need to enable pushing via git:// explicitly.

Just git trivia.
Show 15 quoted lines
> > common firewall filtering of the git protocol port 9418 is another
> > problem. ssh is the prefered protocol for writing to a remote
> > protocol. But if ssh is filtered, then http/https may be used, which
> > is very slow for large repositories, but it has the advantage that it
> > is the least blocked protocol.
> 
> Slow for large repositories? Are you thinking of the dumb HTTP
> transport? That one shouldn't be used for doing any serious work. The
> Smart HTTP transport is just the git smart protocol (the same one
> git:// and ssh:// URLs speak) wrapped inside HTTP communication. The
> negotiation phase is a more expensive than with either git or ssh, as
> HTTP is stateless and you need to remind the remote what you want and
> what you've already agreed on, but the actual transfer of data is done
> the same way than with the others so overall it shouldn't be that
> noticeable.
Note that for "smart" transports ("smart" HTTP, SSH) you need to have
git installed on server, or at least have git-upload-pack and
git-receive-pack somewhere (you can configure client where it is to be
found on server).
 
Note that git uses curl for both smart and dumb HTTP transports, so
things like 'http_proxy' and 'HTTPS_PROXY' environment variables
should work.
Show 8 quoted lines
> Now, to the OP's concerns: yes, the ssh transport does generate ssh
> transport, as that's the whole point. You authenticate against the
> remote machine's ssh daemon and run git-upload-pack or
> git-receive-pack as needed (for fetching or pushing). If corporate
> policy doesn't allow ssh you should either fix the policy or use the
> smart HTTP protocol, though this involves messing with passwords and
> their associated problems. I'm not saying ssh keys don't have their
> complications, but I much prefer them.
Note that if the problem is giving shell accounts with SSH access, the
solution is to use one of git repository management tools, like
Gitosis (Python + setuptools, no longer developed) or Gitolite (Perl).
From what I remember both use _single_ *restricted* account and
public-key authenthication.
 
If I am not mistaken Gitolite can help with "smart" HTTP transport
access too.
Show 5 quoted lines
> We can't help you diagnose why your clone is stalling without more
> information. It could be that the connection between the computers is
> flaky, git trying to take too much memory on the remote or local
> machines or any number of things. See if setting GIT_TRACE=1 in the
> environment helps to see what's going on.
Or even undocumented (!) GIT_TRACE_PACKET.
-- 
Jakub Narebski
Reza Mostafid· Dec 28, 2011, 11:01 UTC · re: Reza Mostafid · lore

Re: GIT and SSH

I forgot to mention, I am an embedded developer located in Iran.

The filtering I am talking about is by the government. All ISP's get their bandwith from centrally allocated trunks. This allows control.

I know that ssh packets get dropped for extended periods frequently. We have an Ubuntu virtual server outside of Iran which we use as a proxy and connect to it via 'ssh' sox provxy ( -D 8090 ).

Many times some sort of script or intelligence is operation which severely throttles the connection as soon as the data rate exceeds certain "benign" levels. All this has been confirmed by the network `gurus` and admin people I work with. This is the best we can tell from what we observe.

As mentioned when we execute the simple GIT clone command from our VPS ( located outside Iran ) the command works flawlessly.

What I would be interested in is to somehow make git avoid using transport over ssh. The government censors are interested only in blocking people accessing illicit sites via S.O.X-5 or VPN.

To them anything over SSH is suspicious. If we could somehow update using a plain transport method, they couldn't care less about source code being sent to us.

Regards
Reza
Thomas Hochstein· Dec 28, 2011, 11:34 UTC · re: Reza Mostafid · lore

Re: GIT and SSH

Reza Mostafid schrieb:
> a.) Does the communication that takes place between a GIT `client` and a remote
>     GIT `repository` involve 'ssh' traffic?
Depends on how you do it (as already described by others).
Show 7 quoted lines
> Our connections here are heavily censored and ssh traffic is suppressed most of
> the time which is why I need to figure out why a simple  
>
>     $ git clone git://<URL> 
>
> command chokes to a halt and freezes most of the time ( the same command when
> executed remotely on our V.P.S. in Europe works flawlessly ).
"git://" uses the git protocol which does not involve SSH.
    $ git clone ssh://<URL>
would use SSH.
-thh

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