{"thread":{"id":"50173","subject":"Translation of git manpages","startedAt":"2019-01-07T20:45:30Z","lastAt":"2019-01-09T11:24:58Z","messageCount":4,"participants":["Jean-Noël AVILA","Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason","Jeff King","Jean-Noël Avila"],"isPatch":false,"patchVersion":null,"patchTotal":null},"messages":[{"id":"366286","messageId":"1992944.NOdEsaAZKb@cayenne","threadId":"50173","inReplyTo":null,"subject":"Translation of git manpages","fromName":"Jean-Noël AVILA","fromEmail":"jn.avila@free.fr","sentAt":"2019-01-07T20:45:12Z","receivedAt":"2019-01-07T20:45:30Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jn.avila@free.fr","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/156172?v=4"},"body":"Dear fellow translators,\n\nI'm trying to put up a longstanding project of providing translated manual \npages for Git. After several experiments, the best choice seemed to be the use \nof po4a[1] to convert the asciidoc[2] sources of git manpages into po files \nthat could be processed the same way we are already doing for the translation \nof Git itself.\n\nThe text is segmented into paragraphs and structural units (titles, list \nitems...) and when translated, they are reinjected into the original text \nstructure. Only inline asciidoc formatting marks are passed in segments. \n\nThe translation takes place in a dedicated repository[3]  . It simpler to not \nmeddle in git main workflow while adjusting the translation workflow. If \neverybody is satisfied with it, we can maybe migrate the repo under git \norganization. Now, this repo is standalone with respect to translation content \nsource, but a patch has been submitted so that the translated manpages can be \ngenerated and installed from the main git project[4]. Symmetrically, there's a \nscript in the project to pull the manpages source files from the main git repo. \n\nThe repository is connected to Weblate[5]  if you have collaborators who don't \nknow how to process po files and prefer translating in the browser. \n\nThe repository is also open to pull-request on the tooling. Let me know if you \nhave issues. In any case, the translation work can be reused for any other \narrangements.\n\nThere is already a kernel of translation in French, from my experiments and a \nprevious effort of German translation[6] was gettextized. If you have such \narchives for other languages, I'd be happy to integrate them, even if they are \nnot up to date.\n\n--\nJean-Noël\n\n[1]: https://po4a.org/\n[2]: http://asciidoc.org/\n[3]: https://github.com/jnavila/git-manpages-l10n\n[4]: https://public-inbox.org/git/20190104165406.22358-1-jn.avila@free.fr/\n[5]: https://hosted.weblate.org/projects/git-manpages/translations/\n[6]: https://repo.or.cz/w/gitman-de.git\n\n\n"},{"id":"366328","messageId":"87lg3v6yqr.fsf@evledraar.gmail.com","threadId":"50173","inReplyTo":"1992944.NOdEsaAZKb@cayenne","subject":"Re: Translation of git manpages","fromName":"Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason","fromEmail":"avarab@gmail.com","sentAt":"2019-01-08T13:54:36Z","receivedAt":"2019-01-08T13:54:43Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"avarab@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/45301?v=4"},"body":"\nOn Mon, Jan 07 2019, Jean-Noël AVILA wrote:\n\n> Dear fellow translators,\n>\n> I'm trying to put up a longstanding project of providing translated manual\n> pages for Git. After several experiments, the best choice seemed to be the use\n> of po4a[1] to convert the asciidoc[2] sources of git manpages into po files\n> that could be processed the same way we are already doing for the translation\n> of Git itself.\n>\n> The text is segmented into paragraphs and structural units (titles, list\n> items...) and when translated, they are reinjected into the original text\n> structure. Only inline asciidoc formatting marks are passed in segments.\n>\n> The translation takes place in a dedicated repository[3]  . It simpler to not\n> meddle in git main workflow while adjusting the translation workflow. If\n> everybody is satisfied with it, we can maybe migrate the repo under git\n> organization. Now, this repo is standalone with respect to translation content\n> source, but a patch has been submitted so that the translated manpages can be\n> generated and installed from the main git project[4]. Symmetrically, there's a\n> script in the project to pull the manpages source files from the main git repo.\n>\n> The repository is connected to Weblate[5]  if you have collaborators who don't\n> know how to process po files and prefer translating in the browser.\n>\n> The repository is also open to pull-request on the tooling. Let me know if you\n> have issues. In any case, the translation work can be reused for any other\n> arrangements.\n>\n> There is already a kernel of translation in French, from my experiments and a\n> previous effort of German translation[6] was gettextized. If you have such\n> archives for other languages, I'd be happy to integrate them, even if they are\n> not up to date.\n\nThanks. This has come up on list many times before and it's great to\nhave some movement on it.\n\nI think a way to have early exposure of these to a lot more people would\nbe to have these on the git-scm.com site. Jeff knows more about the\nbuild process there.\n\nI see the general completion of French & German is at ~10%, but maybe\nthere's some pages that are fully translated already? We could then have\nsome UI or git-scm.com that allows you to switch between languages along\nwith some general overview page per-language.\n\nAre the translations contributed through\nhttps://hosted.weblate.org/projects/git-manpages/translations/ something\nthat license-wise (Signed-off-by etc.) we'd eventually be able to\nupstream in git.git?\n\nIt would be great to eventually have something we can build as part of\nour build process, so e.g. Debian can have git-man-de similar to\nmanpages-de now.\n"},{"id":"366406","messageId":"20190109103227.GB6743@sigill.intra.peff.net","threadId":"50173","inReplyTo":"87lg3v6yqr.fsf@evledraar.gmail.com","subject":"Re: Translation of git manpages","fromName":"Jeff King","fromEmail":"peff@peff.net","sentAt":"2019-01-09T10:32:27Z","receivedAt":"2019-01-09T10:32:31Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"peff@peff.net","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/45925?v=4"},"body":"On Tue, Jan 08, 2019 at 02:54:36PM +0100, Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason wrote:\n\n> > There is already a kernel of translation in French, from my experiments and a\n> > previous effort of German translation[6] was gettextized. If you have such\n> > archives for other languages, I'd be happy to integrate them, even if they are\n> > not up to date.\n> \n> Thanks. This has come up on list many times before and it's great to\n> have some movement on it.\n> \n> I think a way to have early exposure of these to a lot more people would\n> be to have these on the git-scm.com site. Jeff knows more about the\n> build process there.\n\nActually, Jean-Noël has done as much or more work as me on the manpage\n(and book) build process for the site. :)\n\nBasically, we just pull the pages from git.git, run them through\nasciidoctor with a few ugly regex tweaks, and then that goes to the\nsite. We should be able to do the same for translations, and I agree\nthat even partial translations on the site may be a good way to get\nexposure. The way the book translations are handled is probably a\nworkable model.\n\n-Peff\n"},{"id":"366407","messageId":"6513e65f-0282-10eb-fd79-059fb44a7d3e@free.fr","threadId":"50173","inReplyTo":"87lg3v6yqr.fsf@evledraar.gmail.com","subject":"Re: Translation of git manpages","fromName":"Jean-Noël Avila","fromEmail":"jn.avila@free.fr","sentAt":"2019-01-09T11:24:23Z","receivedAt":"2019-01-09T11:24:58Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jn.avila@free.fr","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/156172?v=4"},"body":"On Wed, Jan 09 2019, Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason wrote:\n> > I think a way to have early exposure of these to a lot more people >\nwould be to have these on the git-scm.com site. Jeff knows more about >\nthe build process there. > > I see the general completion of French &\nGerman is at ~10%, but > maybe there's some pages that are fully\ntranslated already? We could > then have some UI or git-scm.com that\nallows you to switch between > languages along with some general\noverview page per-language.\n\nPublishing on git-scm is on my TODO list. It' s a bit more difficult\nthan updating the original manpages, because the translation process\nwith po4a cannot be done in memory, which does not fit with the way the\npublishing is done directly from gitster/git repo on github into the\ndatabase, plus the underlying data structure of the website needs to\nevolve to account for new languages (and Ruby on Rails is a special beast) .\n\n\n\n> > > Are the translations contributed through >\nhttps://hosted.weblate.org/projects/git-manpages/translations/ >\nsomething that license-wise (Signed-off-by etc.) we'd eventually be >\nable to upstream in git.git?\nI retained the same license as Git for the translation repo, to prevent\nfuture issues with integration of the result in other projects. Right\nnow, there's no Signed-off-by line in Weblate issued commits. I opened\nan issue to have them added. Should this policy have been enforced from\nthe start or is it too late for later inclusion in git.git?\n\n\n> > It would be great to eventually have something we can build as part >\nof our build process, so e.g. Debian can have git-man-de similar to >\nmanpages-de now.\nI don't understand you remark. The point of the proposed patch is to\nallow to build and install the translated manpages from a working tree\nof git, by adding a checkout of git-manpages-l10n in a subdir of\nDocumentation (note to self: propose a patch to document this). From\nthis setup, generating proper localized manpage packages is perfectly\ndoable. Am I missing anything?\n\n\n\n"}]}