{"thread":{"id":"25093","subject":"Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","startedAt":"2010-09-13T15:02:45Z","lastAt":"2010-09-14T07:21:07Z","messageCount":11,"participants":["Thomas Klausner","Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason","Chris Packham","Andreas Schwab","Jay Soffian"],"isPatch":false,"patchVersion":null,"patchTotal":null},"messages":[{"id":"150599","messageId":"20100913150245.GT22527@danbala.tuwien.ac.at","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":null,"subject":"Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Thomas Klausner","fromEmail":"tk@giga.or.at","sentAt":"2010-09-13T15:02:45Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-13T15:02:45Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"tk@giga.or.at","avatar":null},"body":"Hi!\n\nI just subscribed to this list and tried reading it in tin.\n\ntin didn't recognize the mails. With help of a tin developer I tracked\nit down and found that the mails from this mailing list come with\nDate:$DATE, i.e. \"Date:\tMon, 13 Sep 2010 08:15:48 +0100 (CET)\"\ninstead of\nDate:$DATE, i.e. \"Date: Mon, 13 Sep 2010 08:15:48 +0100 (CET)\"\n\nWhile this doesn't seem to be forbidden by the RFC, I think it is\nat least uncommon, and here it causes trouble. Could you please change\nthis?\n\nThanks,\n Thomas\n"},{"id":"150606","messageId":"AANLkTinEb9geKox+a+HosQn-g4eKd-DW4agRCf8yqv=k@mail.gmail.com","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":"20100913150245.GT22527@danbala.tuwien.ac.at","subject":"Re: Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason","fromEmail":"avarab@gmail.com","sentAt":"2010-09-13T18:03:03Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-13T18:03:03Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"avarab@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/45301?v=4"},"body":"On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 15:02, Thomas Klausner wrote:\n\n> While this doesn't seem to be forbidden by the RFC, I think it is\n> at least uncommon, and here it causes trouble. Could you please change\n> this?\n\nWouldn't it be better to just change tin to be RFC compliant?\n"},{"id":"150609","messageId":"4C8E6C7B.2090904@gmail.com","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":"AANLkTinEb9geKox+a+HosQn-g4eKd-DW4agRCf8yqv=k@mail.gmail.com","subject":"Re: Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Chris Packham","fromEmail":"judge.packham@gmail.com","sentAt":"2010-09-13T18:24:59Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-13T18:24:59Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"judge.packham@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/155667?v=4"},"body":"On 13/09/10 11:03, Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason wrote:\n> On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 15:02, Thomas Klausner wrote:\n> \n>> While this doesn't seem to be forbidden by the RFC, I think it is\n>> at least uncommon, and here it causes trouble. Could you please change\n>> this?\n> \n> Wouldn't it be better to just change tin to be RFC compliant?\n\nThere is also a problem with your definition of \"uncommon\". I haven't\nchecked but I'm guessing the tabs are there for every mailing list run\nby vger.kernel.org. Those are some of the highest volume mailing lists\nthat I know of. It can't be to hard to change tin to parse a tab or\nspace character.\n"},{"id":"150610","messageId":"20100913182651.GD7006@danbala.tuwien.ac.at","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":"AANLkTinEb9geKox+a+HosQn-g4eKd-DW4agRCf8yqv=k@mail.gmail.com","subject":"Re: Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Thomas Klausner","fromEmail":"tk@giga.or.at","sentAt":"2010-09-13T18:26:51Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-13T18:26:51Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"tk@giga.or.at","avatar":null},"body":"On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 06:03:03PM +0000, Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason wrote:\n> Wouldn't it be better to just change tin to be RFC compliant?\n\nIt is compliant to the ones for News. They specify a space after the\ncolon.\n\nThe ones for mail are a bit more relaxed, it seems.\n Thomas\n"},{"id":"150611","messageId":"20100913183054.GE7006@danbala.tuwien.ac.at","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":"4C8E6C7B.2090904@gmail.com","subject":"Re: Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Thomas Klausner","fromEmail":"tk@giga.or.at","sentAt":"2010-09-13T18:30:54Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-13T18:30:54Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"tk@giga.or.at","avatar":null},"body":"On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 11:24:59AM -0700, Chris Packham wrote:\n> There is also a problem with your definition of \"uncommon\". I haven't\n> checked but I'm guessing the tabs are there for every mailing list run\n> by vger.kernel.org. Those are some of the highest volume mailing lists\n> that I know of. It can't be to hard to change tin to parse a tab or\n> space character.\n\nI'm sorry if you don't like my choice of words. I have subscribed to a\nnumber of mailing lists and read them in tin without stumbling over\nthis problem.\n\nIs my request so much to ask?\n Thomas\n"},{"id":"150613","messageId":"AANLkTi=Eyq=UmOenJSfxOtBcuZDwxG1ooKgcA=Vf-qG1@mail.gmail.com","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":"20100913183054.GE7006@danbala.tuwien.ac.at","subject":"Re: Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason","fromEmail":"avarab@gmail.com","sentAt":"2010-09-13T18:37:07Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-13T18:37:07Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"avarab@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/45301?v=4"},"body":"On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 18:30, Thomas Klausner wrote:\n> On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 11:24:59AM -0700, Chris Packham wrote:\n>> There is also a problem with your definition of \"uncommon\". I haven't\n>> checked but I'm guessing the tabs are there for every mailing list run\n>> by vger.kernel.org. Those are some of the highest volume mailing lists\n>> that I know of. It can't be to hard to change tin to parse a tab or\n>> space character.\n>\n> I'm sorry if you don't like my choice of words. I have subscribed to a\n> number of mailing lists and read them in tin without stumbling over\n> this problem.\n>\n> Is my request so much to ask?\n\nWell, yeah. You're asking that someone that maintains the mailing list\ngo and modify the mailing list software due to some trivial bug in a\nnon-RFC compliant client.\n\nThe bug can presumably just be fixed by changing something like this\nin tin:\n\n while (*s++ == '') { ... }\n\nto:\n\n while (isspace(*s++)) { ... }\n\nSo why not just do that? Then you'll have fixed the bug for all tin\nusers regardless of what mailing list they're subscribing to.\n"},{"id":"150616","messageId":"4C8E7445.6070604@gmail.com","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":"20100913183054.GE7006@danbala.tuwien.ac.at","subject":"Re: Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Chris Packham","fromEmail":"judge.packham@gmail.com","sentAt":"2010-09-13T18:58:13Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-13T18:58:13Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"judge.packham@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/155667?v=4"},"body":"On 13/09/10 11:30, Thomas Klausner wrote:\n> On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 11:24:59AM -0700, Chris Packham wrote:\n>> There is also a problem with your definition of \"uncommon\". I haven't\n>> checked but I'm guessing the tabs are there for every mailing list run\n>> by vger.kernel.org. Those are some of the highest volume mailing lists\n>> that I know of. It can't be to hard to change tin to parse a tab or\n>> space character.\n> \n> I'm sorry if you don't like my choice of words. I have subscribed to a\n> number of mailing lists and read them in tin without stumbling over\n> this problem.\n\nAnd I'm sorry if that came of a little terse. Honestly since the advent\nof web based mail/news viewers I've never really bothered with using one\nso I'm fairly ignorant.\n\n> Is my request so much to ask?\n> Thomas\n\nMy point was you're not asking the maintainer of the git mailing list to\nchange something. You're asking the maintainers of all mailing lists run\nfrom vger.kernel.org to change something (i.e. a much greater scale).\nAgain my ignorance as to how things are run at kernel.org may be\ndistorting reality.\n\nYou may get more mileage out of asking the developers of the majordomo\nsoftware [1]. But even if they do make a change it may take a while to\nbe deployed on kernel.org\n\n[1] http://www.greatcircle.com/majordomo/\n"},{"id":"150629","messageId":"m2wrqpmkut.fsf@igel.home","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":"20100913182651.GD7006@danbala.tuwien.ac.at","subject":"Re: Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Andreas Schwab","fromEmail":"schwab@linux-m68k.org","sentAt":"2010-09-13T20:47:38Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-13T20:47:38Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"schwab@linux-m68k.org","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/2175493?v=4"},"body":"Thomas Klausner writes:\n\n> On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 06:03:03PM +0000, Ævar Arnfjörð Bjarmason wrote:\n>> Wouldn't it be better to just change tin to be RFC compliant?\n>\n> It is compliant to the ones for News. They specify a space after the\n> colon.\n>\n> The ones for mail are a bit more relaxed, it seems.\n\nMail is not news, but if you prefer news you can use news.gmane.org.\n\nAndreas.\n\n-- \nAndreas Schwab, schwab@linux-m68k.org\nGPG Key fingerprint = 58CA 54C7 6D53 942B 1756 01D3 44D5 214B 8276 4ED5\n\"And now for something completely different.\"\n"},{"id":"150634","messageId":"AANLkTinTs+ym5pTBaPCVsFLyp-KKTQW7FknCgcTFRUYW@mail.gmail.com","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":"4C8E7445.6070604@gmail.com","subject":"Re: Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Jay Soffian","fromEmail":"jaysoffian@gmail.com","sentAt":"2010-09-13T22:08:56Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-13T22:08:56Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jaysoffian@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/155970?v=4"},"body":"On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 2:58 PM, Chris Packham wrote:\n> You may get more mileage out of asking the developers of the majordomo\n\nAFAIK, majordomo hasn't been touched in almost a decade, so I doubt it.\n\nj.\n"},{"id":"150665","messageId":"20100914072045.GL7006@danbala.tuwien.ac.at","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":"4C8E7445.6070604@gmail.com","subject":"Re: Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Thomas Klausner","fromEmail":"tk@giga.or.at","sentAt":"2010-09-14T07:20:45Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-14T07:20:45Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"tk@giga.or.at","avatar":null},"body":"On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 11:58:13AM -0700, Chris Packham wrote:\n> You may get more mileage out of asking the developers of the majordomo\n> software [1]. But even if they do make a change it may take a while to\n> be deployed on kernel.org\n\nThanks for the tip.\n\nI don't think it's a problem with majordomo, though. I'm subscribed to\na lot of majordomo lists without seeing tabs in the date field.\n Thomas\n"},{"id":"150666","messageId":"20100914072107.GM7006@danbala.tuwien.ac.at","threadId":"25093","inReplyTo":"m2wrqpmkut.fsf@igel.home","subject":"Re: Mailing list headers: Date: instead of Date:","fromName":"Thomas Klausner","fromEmail":"tk@giga.or.at","sentAt":"2010-09-14T07:21:07Z","receivedAt":"2010-09-14T07:21:07Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"tk@giga.or.at","avatar":null},"body":"On Mon, Sep 13, 2010 at 10:47:38PM +0200, Andreas Schwab wrote:\n> Mail is not news, but if you prefer news you can use news.gmane.org.\n\nThat's a good idea, thanks.\n Thomas\n"}]}