{"thread":{"id":"21373","subject":"Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","startedAt":"2009-10-27T10:12:52Z","lastAt":"2010-05-28T22:53:25Z","messageCount":11,"participants":["Matthieu Moy","Johannes Schindelin","Clemens Buchacher","Hervé Cauwelier","Jakub Narebski","Clément Poulain"],"isPatch":false,"patchVersion":null,"patchTotal":null},"messages":[{"id":"126000","messageId":"vpqocntxhzv.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":null,"subject":"Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Matthieu Moy","fromEmail":"matthieu.moy@grenoble-inp.fr","sentAt":"2009-10-27T10:12:52Z","receivedAt":"2009-10-27T10:12:52Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"matthieu.moy@grenoble-inp.fr","avatar":"https://gravatar.com/avatar/72c8a2705971a25dfaff23cece15130d405685845d911aedd5667ace277f3fc5?d=mp&s=160"},"body":"Hi,\n\nI'd like to propose a kind of mini-google summer of code to the\nstudents of the the school where I teach, i.e. Ensimag, France\n( http://ensimag.grenoble-inp.fr/ ). In short, this means having a few\nstudents working for Git for a month at no cost ;-).\n\nCurrently, the students have an end-of-year project (in equivalent of\nmaster 1) with the choice between many subjects, some of them being\nsomehow \"real-life\" (i.e. actually usefull things), and other being\nartificial (i.e. enjoy doing it, and throw it away afterwards).\n\nThis year, I'd like to propose a subject \"contribution to an existing\nfree software\", and since the one I know best currently is Git, this\nwould take the form of \"contribution to the Git project\". I'd see the\npractical organization a bit like the google summer of code: chose a\nfeature (the GSoC proposals on the wiki can be a good source of\ninspiration), and implement it with the goal of being eventually\nmerged upstream. There would be no money involved, but the students\nget a grade at the end. I would anyway follow the work of the\nstudents, but a co-mentoring from a Git expert would be great.\n\nThe students work full-time for about 3 weeks (May 20th to June 16th),\nand are grouped by teams of 2 to 4 students. Given my bandwidth, I\nplan to propose only one group of 4 students this year, but we may\nscale up later, who knows.\n\nWe have plenty of time before this starts, but I'm just sending this\nemail to get your feeling on it.\n\nAny opinion? Do you like the idea?\n\n-- \nMatthieu Moy\nhttp://www-verimag.imag.fr/~moy/\n"},{"id":"126014","messageId":"alpine.DEB.1.00.0910271456490.4985@pacific.mpi-cbg.de","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":"vpqocntxhzv.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","subject":"Re: Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","sentAt":"2009-10-27T13:59:43Z","receivedAt":"2009-10-27T13:59:43Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/127790?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nOn Tue, 27 Oct 2009, Matthieu Moy wrote:\n\n> I'd like to propose a kind of mini-google summer of code to the students \n> of the the school where I teach, i.e. Ensimag, France ( \n> http://ensimag.grenoble-inp.fr/ ). In short, this means having a few \n> students working for Git for a month at no cost ;-).\n\nDo not underestimate the cost of time and nerves, both on the student's \nand the mentor's part.\n\nI spent an insane amount of time on the Google Summer of Code this year, \na relatively small (but not less frustrating) part of which was with Git.  \n\nCiao,\nDscho\n"},{"id":"126022","messageId":"20091027144405.GA12464@localhost","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":"vpqocntxhzv.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","subject":"Re: Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Clemens Buchacher","fromEmail":"drizzd@aon.at","sentAt":"2009-10-27T14:44:05Z","receivedAt":"2009-10-27T14:44:05Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"drizzd@gmx.net","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/59082?v=4"},"body":"On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 11:12:52AM +0100, Matthieu Moy wrote:\n\n> The students work full-time for about 3 weeks (May 20th to June 16th),\n> and are grouped by teams of 2 to 4 students. Given my bandwidth, I\n> plan to propose only one group of 4 students this year, but we may\n> scale up later, who knows.\n\nThat's not much time to get familiar with a complex project like git. So you\nwill have to do something extremely simple, which probably means that it\nwon't be anything exciting. If it were, someone else would have done it\nalready.\n\nClemens\n"},{"id":"126029","messageId":"4AE71629.6050208@itaapy.com","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":"vpqocntxhzv.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","subject":"Re: Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Hervé Cauwelier","fromEmail":"herve@itaapy.com","sentAt":"2009-10-27T15:47:53Z","receivedAt":"2009-10-27T15:47:53Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"herve@itaapy.com","avatar":null},"body":"On 27/10/2009 11:12, Matthieu Moy wrote:\n> Hi,\n>\n> I'd like to propose a kind of mini-google summer of code to the\n> students of the the school where I teach, i.e. Ensimag, France\n> ( http://ensimag.grenoble-inp.fr/ ). In short, this means having a few\n> students working for Git for a month at no cost ;-).\n\nHave you considered projects contributing to libgit2? The students at \nULCO [1] will be mentored by Andreas Ericsson.\n\nGiven that libgit2 is quite empty, there are many small tasks like \nstarting commits, trees, tags, etc. objects.\n\nBut I guess he won't have time for mentoring more students.\n\n[1] \nhttp://dpt-info.univ-littoral.fr/mediawiki/index.php/I2L:Projet#libgit2_-_Herv.C3.A9_Cauwelier_-_itaapy\n\n-- \nHervé Cauwelier - ITAAPY - 9 rue Darwin 75018 Paris\nTél. 01 42 23 67 45 - Fax 01 53 28 27 88\nhttp://www.itaapy.com/ - http://www.cms-migration.com\n"},{"id":"126031","messageId":"vpqfx94vnmh.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":"alpine.DEB.1.00.0910271456490.4985@pacific.mpi-cbg.de","subject":"Re: Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Matthieu Moy","fromEmail":"matthieu.moy@grenoble-inp.fr","sentAt":"2009-10-27T15:54:14Z","receivedAt":"2009-10-27T15:54:14Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"matthieu.moy@grenoble-inp.fr","avatar":"https://gravatar.com/avatar/72c8a2705971a25dfaff23cece15130d405685845d911aedd5667ace277f3fc5?d=mp&s=160"},"body":"Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de> writes:\n\n> Hi,\n>\n> On Tue, 27 Oct 2009, Matthieu Moy wrote:\n>\n>> I'd like to propose a kind of mini-google summer of code to the students \n>> of the the school where I teach, i.e. Ensimag, France ( \n>> http://ensimag.grenoble-inp.fr/ ). In short, this means having a few \n>> students working for Git for a month at no cost ;-).\n>\n> Do not underestimate the cost of time and nerves, both on the student's \n> and the mentor's part.\n\nHey, you're talking to a teacher ;-).\n\nYes, for sure, this takes a lot of time. But on my side that's my job,\nthe school gives me time to mentor the students. And I'll be\ngeographically close to the students, having regular physical\nmeetings, ... I'd appreciate a co-mentor, but the feedback from the\nmailing list (like the one for non-school-related contributors) plus\nmy mentoring can be sufficient.\n\n-- \nMatthieu Moy\nhttp://www-verimag.imag.fr/~moy/\n"},{"id":"126033","messageId":"vpqaazcvlur.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":"4AE71629.6050208@itaapy.com","subject":"Re: Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Matthieu Moy","fromEmail":"matthieu.moy@grenoble-inp.fr","sentAt":"2009-10-27T16:32:28Z","receivedAt":"2009-10-27T16:32:28Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"matthieu.moy@grenoble-inp.fr","avatar":"https://gravatar.com/avatar/72c8a2705971a25dfaff23cece15130d405685845d911aedd5667ace277f3fc5?d=mp&s=160"},"body":"Hervé Cauwelier <herve@itaapy.com> writes:\n\n> Have you considered projects contributing to libgit2?\n\nRight now, the project is just an idea, so I didn't consider an idea\nin particular. But I'd love to get people to work on libgit2 (I really\nthink this is _the_ thing that SVN has and that Git lacks), and\ntherefore, I'd love my students to work on this.\n\nBut as much as possible, I'll wait and decide the exact project with\nthe students.\n\n> The students at ULCO [1] will be mentored by Andreas Ericsson.\n\nThanks for the pointer.\n\n> Given that libgit2 is quite empty, there are many small tasks like\n> starting commits, trees, tags, etc. objects.\n\nOTOH, I don't know whether we'd get as much feedback working on\nlibgit2 than working on Git itself.\n\n-- \nMatthieu Moy\nhttp://www-verimag.imag.fr/~moy/\n"},{"id":"126034","messageId":"vpq63a0vljm.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":"20091027144405.GA12464@localhost","subject":"Re: Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Matthieu Moy","fromEmail":"matthieu.moy@grenoble-inp.fr","sentAt":"2009-10-27T16:39:09Z","receivedAt":"2009-10-27T16:39:09Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"matthieu.moy@grenoble-inp.fr","avatar":"https://gravatar.com/avatar/72c8a2705971a25dfaff23cece15130d405685845d911aedd5667ace277f3fc5?d=mp&s=160"},"body":"Clemens Buchacher <drizzd@aon.at> writes:\n\n> That's not much time to get familiar with a complex project like git. So you\n> will have to do something extremely simple,\n\nThat very much depends on which students. Some of our students are\nalready experienced programmers when the enter the school. If I manage\nto attract such students, a group of 4 can do a bit more than\n\"extremely simple\".\n\n> which probably means that it won't be anything exciting. \n\nDepending \"exiting for who\" ... my first contributions to free\nsoftware were very trivial code, and I found it very exciting the day\nI got 20 trivial lines of code of mine into GNU Emacs ;-).\n\nSo, the feature may not be exciting, but I think the experience for\nstudents could be.\n\n-- \nMatthieu Moy\nhttp://www-verimag.imag.fr/~moy/\n"},{"id":"126184","messageId":"m3r5sncfbv.fsf@localhost.localdomain","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":"20091027144405.GA12464@localhost","subject":"Re: Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Jakub Narebski","fromEmail":"jnareb@gmail.com","sentAt":"2009-10-28T22:41:32Z","receivedAt":"2009-10-28T22:41:32Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jnareb@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/2706?v=4"},"body":"Clemens Buchacher <drizzd@aon.at> writes:\n\n> On Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 11:12:52AM +0100, Matthieu Moy wrote:\n> \n> > The students work full-time for about 3 weeks (May 20th to June 16th),\n> > and are grouped by teams of 2 to 4 students. Given my bandwidth, I\n> > plan to propose only one group of 4 students this year, but we may\n> > scale up later, who knows.\n> \n> That's not much time to get familiar with a complex project like git. So you\n> will have to do something extremely simple, which probably means that it\n> won't be anything exciting. If it were, someone else would have done it\n> already.\n\nLet's take a look at some projects from SoC2009Ideas and Wishlist:\n* \"smart\" HTTP transport is being actively worked on\n* narrow / sparse checkout is being worked on\n* directory renames development stalled, I think last was in\n  http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.version-control.git/99529\n* git-svnserver has supposedly partial Python implementation\n* restartable clone, which should be fairly easy to add to \"dumb\"\n  protocols, and quite challenging to add to \"smart\" protocols;\n  even without a code, having fresh ideas would be nice\n* (optional) support for empty directories, needs index extension,\n  there were some patches, but the area might be muddy\n\nIt all depends on what you want to achieve in this short time.  Would\nit be to get to know OSS development workflow (submitting patches,\nanswering reviews, etc.), or would it be solving interesting real-life\nproblem, or perhaps solving some problem from beginning to the end\n(the code being accepted).\n\n-- \nJakub Narebski\nPoland\nShadeHawk on #git\n"},{"id":"142061","messageId":"AANLkTikF0rvZtl5HQl9laQZryqnh4W318GB5YIc1Zp4q@mail.gmail.com","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":"vpqocntxhzv.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","subject":"Re: Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Matthieu Moy","fromEmail":"matthieu.moy@imag.fr","sentAt":"2010-05-21T17:44:42Z","receivedAt":"2010-05-21T17:44:42Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"git@matthieu-moy.fr","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/14709?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nI'm resurecting an old thread :\n\n  http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.version-control.git/131321\n  (message copied below)\n\nand welcoming Diane, Axel and Clément (CC-ed), 3 students who have\nchosen this project. Right now, they're trying to get familiar with\nthe codebase. As a first exercice, they'll try to add textconv support\nto git-blame. The next tasks are undecided yet (but advices are\nwelcome).\n\nI hope the project will be productive, both for students and the Git community!\n\nOn Tue, Oct 27, 2009 at 12:12 PM, Matthieu Moy\n<Matthieu.Moy@grenoble-inp.fr> wrote:\n> Hi,\n>\n> I'd like to propose a kind of mini-google summer of code to the\n> students of the the school where I teach, i.e. Ensimag, France\n> ( http://ensimag.grenoble-inp.fr/ ). In short, this means having a few\n> students working for Git for a month at no cost ;-).\n>\n> Currently, the students have an end-of-year project (in equivalent of\n> master 1) with the choice between many subjects, some of them being\n> somehow \"real-life\" (i.e. actually usefull things), and other being\n> artificial (i.e. enjoy doing it, and throw it away afterwards).\n>\n> This year, I'd like to propose a subject \"contribution to an existing\n> free software\", and since the one I know best currently is Git, this\n> would take the form of \"contribution to the Git project\". I'd see the\n> practical organization a bit like the google summer of code: chose a\n> feature (the GSoC proposals on the wiki can be a good source of\n> inspiration), and implement it with the goal of being eventually\n> merged upstream. There would be no money involved, but the students\n> get a grade at the end. I would anyway follow the work of the\n> students, but a co-mentoring from a Git expert would be great.\n>\n> The students work full-time for about 3 weeks (May 20th to June 16th),\n> and are grouped by teams of 2 to 4 students. Given my bandwidth, I\n> plan to propose only one group of 4 students this year, but we may\n> scale up later, who knows.\n>\n> We have plenty of time before this starts, but I'm just sending this\n> email to get your feeling on it.\n>\n> Any opinion? Do you like the idea?\n\n-- \nMatthieu\n"},{"id":"142090","messageId":"20100522112652.GA15328@localhost","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":"AANLkTikF0rvZtl5HQl9laQZryqnh4W318GB5YIc1Zp4q@mail.gmail.com","subject":"Re: Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Clemens Buchacher","fromEmail":"drizzd@aon.at","sentAt":"2010-05-22T11:26:52Z","receivedAt":"2010-05-22T11:26:52Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"drizzd@gmx.net","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/59082?v=4"},"body":"On Fri, May 21, 2010 at 07:44:42PM +0200, Matthieu Moy wrote:\n\n> As a first exercice, they'll try to add textconv support\n> to git-blame. The next tasks are undecided yet (but advices are\n> welcome).\n\nJust FYI, there is a patch pending to add textconv support to git-gui.\n\n http://mid.gmane.org/20100415193944.GA5848@localhost\n\nClemens\n"},{"id":"142508","messageId":"4C004965.6040802@ensimag.imag.fr","threadId":"21373","inReplyTo":"20100522112652.GA15328@localhost","subject":"Re: Getting Ensimag students to work on Git for a few weeks","fromName":"Clément Poulain","fromEmail":"clement.poulain@ensimag.imag.fr","sentAt":"2010-05-28T22:53:25Z","receivedAt":"2010-05-28T22:53:25Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"clement.poulain@ensimag.imag.fr","avatar":null},"body":"Le 22/05/2010 13:26, Clemens Buchacher a écrit :\n> On Fri, May 21, 2010 at 07:44:42PM +0200, Matthieu Moy wrote:\n>\n>    \n>> As a first exercice, they'll try to add textconv support\n>> to git-blame. The next tasks are undecided yet (but advices are\n>> welcome).\n>>      \n> Just FYI, there is a patch pending to add textconv support to git-gui.\n>\n>   http://mid.gmane.org/20100415193944.GA5848@localhost\n>\n> Clemens\n>    \nThank you for this information.\n\nAs we are about to finish to add textconv support to git-blame, we'll \nnow look to add it to git-gui blame.\nWe wonder what would be the best choice between add a second option \"Use \nTextconv For Blames\", or transform the existing one (introduced by the \npatch above) into \"Use Textconv For Diffs and Blames\" (so the user \nwouldn't have the choice to use textconv only for Diffs or only for \nBlames; is it really usefull ?).\nYour advice is welcome !\n\nThanks,\nClément\n"}]}