{"thread":{"id":"11825","subject":"[ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","startedAt":"2008-02-02T04:34:24Z","lastAt":"2008-02-09T09:25:37Z","messageCount":62,"participants":["Junio C Hamano","Junichi Uekawa","しらいしななこ","Wincent Colaiuta","Johannes Schindelin","Steffen Prohaska","Christian Couder","Pierre Habouzit","Theodore Tso","Matthieu Moy","Jakub Narebski","Dmitry Potapov","Jari Aalto","Luciano Rocha","Eyvind Bernhardsen","David Kastrup","Michael Poole","Nicolas Pitre","Linus Torvalds","Jeremy Maitin-Shepard","Jonathan del Strother","Schuberth, Sebastian","Andreas Ericsson"],"isPatch":false,"patchVersion":null,"patchTotal":null},"messages":[{"id":"67079","messageId":"7vmyqk563z.fsf@gitster.siamese.dyndns.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":null,"subject":"[ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Junio C Hamano","fromEmail":"gitster@pobox.com","sentAt":"2008-02-02T04:34:24Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-02T04:34:24Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"gitster@pobox.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/54884?v=4"},"body":"The latest feature release GIT 1.5.4 is available at the usual\nplaces:\n\n  http://www.kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/\n\n  git-1.5.4.tar.{gz,bz2}\t\t\t(tarball)\n  git-htmldocs-1.5.4.tar.{gz,bz2}\t\t(preformatted docs)\n  git-manpages-1.5.4.tar.{gz,bz2}\t\t(preformatted docs)\n  RPMS/$arch/git-*-1.5.4-1.$arch.rpm\t(RPM)\n\nIt has been an unusually long cycle.  5 months since the last\nfeature release 1.5.3 was really a bit too long.\n\nBut I hope it was worth waiting for.  Thanks everybody for\nworking hard to improve it.\n\n\nChanges since v1.5.3:\n\n 1595 non-merge commits\n  165 contributors\n  684 files changed, 70435 insertions, 28984 deletions\n\n----------------------------------------------------------------\n\nGIT v1.5.4 Release Notes\n========================\n\nRemoval\n-------\n\n * \"git svnimport\" was removed in favor of \"git svn\".  It is still there\n   in the source tree (contrib/examples) but unsupported.\n\n * As git-commit and git-status have been rewritten, \"git runstatus\"\n   helper script lost all its users and has been removed.\n\n\nTemporarily disabled\n--------------------\n\n * \"git http-push\" is known not to work well with cURL library older\n   than 7.16, and we had reports of repository corruption.  It is\n   disabled on such platforms for now.  Unfortunately, 1.5.3.8 shares\n   the same issue.  In other words, this does not mean you will be\n   fine if you stick to an older git release.  For now, please do not\n   use http-push from older git with cURL older than 7.16 if you\n   value your data. A proper fix will hopefully materialize in\n   later versions.\n\n\nDeprecation notices\n-------------------\n\n * From v1.6.0, git will by default install dashed form of commands\n   (e.g. \"git-commit\") outside of users' normal $PATH, and will install\n   only selected commands (\"git\" itself, and \"gitk\") in $PATH.  This\n   implies:\n\n   - Using dashed forms of git commands (e.g. \"git-commit\") from the\n     command line has been informally deprecated since early 2006, but\n     now it officially is, and will be removed in the future.  Use\n     dash-less forms (e.g. \"git commit\") instead.\n\n   - Using dashed forms from your scripts, without first prepending the\n     return value from \"git --exec-path\" to the scripts' PATH, has been\n     informally deprecated since early 2006, but now it officially is.\n\n   - Use of dashed forms with \"PATH=$(git --exec-path):$PATH; export\n     PATH\" early in your script is not deprecated with this change.\n\n   Users are strongly encouraged to adjust their habits and scripts now\n   to prepare for this change.\n\n * The post-receive hook was introduced in March 2007 to supersede\n   the post-update hook, primarily to overcome the command line length\n   limitation of the latter.  Use of post-update hook will be deprecated\n   in future versions of git, starting from v1.6.0.\n\n * \"git lost-found\" was deprecated in favor of \"git fsck\"'s --lost-found\n   option, and will be removed in the future.\n\n * \"git peek-remote\" is deprecated, as \"git ls-remote\" was written in C\n   and works for all transports; \"git peek-remote\" will be removed in\n   the future.\n\n * \"git repo-config\" which was an old name for \"git config\" command\n   has been supported without being advertised for a long time.  The\n   next feature release will remove it.\n\n * From v1.6.0, the repack.usedeltabaseoffset config option will default\n   to true, which will give denser packfiles (i.e. more efficient storage).\n   The downside is that git older than version 1.4.4 will not be able\n   to directly use a repository packed using this setting.\n\n * From v1.6.0, the pack.indexversion config option will default to 2,\n   which is slightly more efficient, and makes repacking more immune to\n   data corruptions.  Git older than version 1.5.2 may revert to version 1\n   of the pack index with a manual \"git index-pack\" to be able to directly\n   access corresponding pack files.\n\n\nUpdates since v1.5.3\n--------------------\n\n * Comes with much improved gitk, with i18n.\n\n * Comes with git-gui 0.9.2 with i18n.\n\n * gitk is now merged as a subdirectory of git.git project, in\n   preparation for its i18n.\n\n * progress displays from many commands are a lot nicer to the eye.\n   Transfer commands show throughput data.\n\n * many commands that pay attention to per-directory .gitignore now do\n   so lazily, which makes the usual case go much faster.\n\n * Output processing for '--pretty=format:<user format>' has been\n   optimized.\n\n * Rename detection of diff family while detecting exact matches has\n   been greatly optimized.\n\n * Rename detection of diff family tries to make more natural looking\n   pairing.  Earlier, if multiple identical rename sources were\n   found in the preimage, the source used was picked pretty much at random.\n\n * Value \"true\" for color.diff and color.status configuration used to\n   mean \"always\" (even when the output is not going to a terminal).\n   This has been corrected to mean the same thing as \"auto\".\n\n * \"git diff\" Porcelain now respects diff.external configuration, which\n   is another way to specify GIT_EXTERNAL_DIFF.\n\n * \"git diff\" can be told to use different prefixes other than\n   \"a/\" and \"b/\" e.g. \"git diff --src-prefix=l/ --dst-prefix=k/\".\n\n * \"git diff\" sometimes did not quote paths with funny\n   characters properly.\n\n * \"git log\" (and any revision traversal commands) misbehaved\n   when --diff-filter is given but was not asked to actually\n   produce diff.\n\n * HTTP proxy can be specified per remote repository using\n   remote.*.httpproxy configuration, or global http.proxy configuration\n   variable.\n\n * Various Perforce importer updates.\n\n * Example update and post-receive hooks have been improved.\n\n * Any command that wants to take a commit object name can now use\n   \":/string\" syntax to name a commit.\n\n * \"git reset\" is now built-in and its output can be squelched with -q.\n\n * \"git reset --hard\" does not make any sense in a bare\n   repository, but did not error out; fixed.\n\n * \"git send-email\" can optionally talk over ssmtp and use SMTP-AUTH.\n\n * \"git rebase\" learned --whitespace option.\n\n * In \"git rebase\", when you decide not to replay a particular change\n   after the command stopped with a conflict, you can say \"git rebase\n   --skip\" without first running \"git reset --hard\", as the command now\n   runs it for you.\n\n * \"git rebase --interactive\" mode can now work on detached HEAD.\n\n * Other minor to serious bugs in \"git rebase -i\" have been fixed.\n\n * \"git rebase\" now detaches head during its operation, so after a\n   successful \"git rebase\" operation, the reflog entry branch@{1} for\n   the current branch points at the commit before the rebase was\n   started.\n\n * \"git rebase -i\" also triggers rerere to help your repeated merges.\n\n * \"git merge\" can call the \"post-merge\" hook.\n\n * \"git pack-objects\" can optionally run deltification with multiple\n   threads.\n\n * \"git archive\" can optionally substitute keywords in files marked with\n   export-subst attribute.\n\n * \"git cherry-pick\" made a misguided attempt to repeat the original\n   command line in the generated log message, when told to cherry-pick a\n   commit by naming a tag that points at it.  It does not anymore.\n\n * \"git for-each-ref\" learned %(xxxdate:<date-format>) syntax to show the\n   various date fields in different formats.\n\n * \"git gc --auto\" is a low-impact way to automatically run a variant of\n   \"git repack\" that does not lose unreferenced objects (read: safer\n   than the usual one) after the user accumulates too many loose\n   objects.\n\n * \"git clean\" has been rewritten in C.\n\n * You need to explicitly set clean.requireForce to \"false\" to allow\n   \"git clean\" without -f to do any damage (lack of the configuration\n   variable used to mean \"do not require -f option to lose untracked\n   files\", but we now use the safer default).\n\n * The kinds of whitespace errors \"git diff\" and \"git apply\" notice (and\n   fix) can be controlled via 'core.whitespace' configuration variable\n   and 'whitespace' attribute in .gitattributes file.\n\n * \"git push\" learned --dry-run option to show what would happen if a\n   push is run.\n\n * \"git push\" does not update a tracking ref on the local side when the\n   remote refused to update the corresponding ref.\n\n * \"git push\" learned --mirror option.  This is to push the local refs\n   one-to-one to the remote, and deletes refs from the remote that do\n   not exist anymore in the repository on the pushing side.\n\n * \"git push\" can remove a corrupt ref at the remote site with the usual\n   \":ref\" refspec.\n\n * \"git remote\" knows --mirror mode.  This is to set up configuration to\n   push into a remote repository to store local branch heads to the same\n   branch on the remote side, and remove branch heads locally removed\n   from local repository at the same time.  Suitable for pushing into a\n   back-up repository.\n\n * \"git remote\" learned \"rm\" subcommand.\n\n * \"git cvsserver\" can be run via \"git shell\".  Also, \"cvs\" is\n   recognized as a synonym for \"git cvsserver\", so that CVS users\n   can be switched to git just by changing their login shell.\n\n * \"git cvsserver\" acts more like receive-pack by running post-receive\n   and post-update hooks.\n\n * \"git am\" and \"git rebase\" are far less verbose.\n\n * \"git pull\" learned to pass --[no-]ff option to underlying \"git\n   merge\".\n\n * \"git pull --rebase\" is a different way to integrate what you fetched\n   into your current branch.\n\n * \"git fast-export\" produces data-stream that can be fed to fast-import\n   to reproduce the history recorded in a git repository.\n\n * \"git add -i\" takes pathspecs to limit the set of files to work on.\n\n * \"git add -p\" is a short-hand to go directly to the selective patch\n   subcommand in the interactive command loop and to exit when done.\n\n * \"git add -i\" UI has been colorized.  The interactive prompt\n   and menu can be colored by setting color.interactive\n   configuration.  The diff output (including the hunk picker)\n   are colored with color.diff configuration.\n\n * \"git commit --allow-empty\" allows you to create a single-parent\n   commit that records the same tree as its parent, overriding the usual\n   safety valve.\n\n * \"git commit --amend\" can amend a merge that does not change the tree\n   from its first parent.\n\n * \"git commit\" used to unconditionally strip comment lines that\n   began with '#' and removed excess blank lines.  This behavior has\n   been made configurable.\n\n * \"git commit\" has been rewritten in C.\n\n * \"git stash random-text\" does not create a new stash anymore.  It was\n   a UI mistake.  Use \"git stash save random-text\", or \"git stash\"\n   (without extra args) for that.\n\n * \"git stash clear extra-text\" does not clear the whole stash\n   anymore.  It is tempting to expect \"git stash clear stash@{2}\"\n   to drop only a single named stash entry, and it is rude to\n   discard everything when that is asked (but not provided).\n\n * \"git prune --expire <time>\" can exempt young loose objects from\n   getting pruned.\n\n * \"git branch --contains <commit>\" can list branches that are\n   descendants of a given commit.\n\n * \"git log\" learned --early-output option to help interactive GUI\n   implementations.\n\n * \"git bisect\" learned \"skip\" action to mark untestable commits.\n\n * \"git bisect visualize\" learned a shorter synonym \"git bisect view\".\n\n * \"git bisect visualize\" runs \"git log\" in a non-windowed\n   environments.  It also can be told what command to run (e.g. \"git\n   bisect visualize tig\").\n\n * \"git format-patch\" learned \"format.numbered\" configuration variable\n   to automatically turn --numbered option on when more than one commits\n   are formatted.\n\n * \"git ls-files\" learned \"--exclude-standard\" to use the canned set of\n   exclude files.\n\n * \"git tag -a -f existing\" begins the editor session using the existing\n   annotation message.\n\n * \"git tag -m one -m bar\" (multiple -m options) behaves similarly to\n   \"git commit\"; the parameters to -m options are formatted as separate\n   paragraphs.\n\n * The format \"git show\" outputs an annotated tag has been updated to\n   include \"Tagger: \" and \"Date: \" lines from the tag itself.  Strictly\n   speaking this is a backward incompatible change, but this is a\n   reasonable usability fix and people's scripts shouldn't have been\n   relying on the exact output from \"git show\" Porcelain anyway.\n\n * \"git cvsimport\" did not notice errors from underlying \"cvsps\"\n   and produced a corrupt import silently.\n\n * \"git cvsexportcommit\" learned -w option to specify and switch to the\n   CVS working directory.\n\n * \"git checkout\" from a subdirectory learned to use \"../path\" to allow\n   checking out a path outside the current directory without cd'ing up.\n\n * \"git checkout\" from and to detached HEAD leaves a bit more\n   information in the reflog.\n\n * \"git send-email --dry-run\" shows full headers for easier diagnosis.\n\n * \"git merge-ours\" is now built-in.\n\n * \"git svn\" learned \"info\" and \"show-externals\" subcommands.\n\n * \"git svn\" run from a subdirectory failed to read settings from the\n   .git/config.\n\n * \"git svn\" learned --use-log-author option, which picks up more\n   descriptive name from From: and Signed-off-by: lines in the commit\n   message.\n\n * \"git svn\" wasted way too much disk to record revision mappings\n   between svn and git; a new representation that is much more compact\n   for this information has been introduced to correct this.\n\n * \"git svn\" left temporary index files it used without cleaning them\n   up; this was corrected.\n\n * \"git status\" from a subdirectory now shows relative paths, which\n   makes copy-and-pasting for git-checkout/git-add/git-rm easier.  The\n   traditional behavior to show the full path relative to the top of\n   the work tree can be had by setting status.relativepaths\n   configuration variable to false.\n\n * \"git blame\" kept text for each annotated revision in core needlessly;\n   this has been corrected.\n\n * \"git shortlog\" learned to default to HEAD when the standard input is\n   a terminal and the user did not give any revision parameter.\n\n * \"git shortlog\" learned \"-e\" option to show e-mail addresses as well as\n   authors' names.\n\n * \"git help\" learned \"-w\" option to show documentation in browsers.\n\n * In addition there are quite a few internal clean-ups. Notably:\n\n   - many fork/exec have been replaced with run-command API,\n     brought from the msysgit effort.\n\n   - introduction and more use of the option parser API.\n\n   - enhancement and more use of the strbuf API.\n\n * Makefile tweaks to support HP-UX is in.\n\nFixes since v1.5.3\n------------------\n\nAll of the fixes in v1.5.3 maintenance series are included in\nthis release, unless otherwise noted.\n\nThese fixes are only in v1.5.4 and not backported to v1.5.3 maintenance\nseries.\n\n * The way \"git diff --check\" behaves is much more consistent with the way\n   \"git apply --whitespace=warn\" works.\n\n * \"git svn\" talking with the SVN over HTTP will correctly quote branch\n   and project names.\n\n * \"git config\" did not work correctly on platforms that define\n   REG_NOMATCH to an even number.\n\n * Recent versions of AsciiDoc 8 has a change to break our\n   documentation; a workaround has been implemented.\n\n * \"git diff --color-words\" colored context lines in a wrong color.\n"},{"id":"67095","messageId":"87k5lnwvzd.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"7vmyqk563z.fsf@gitster.siamese.dyndns.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Junichi Uekawa","fromEmail":"dancer@netfort.gr.jp","sentAt":"2008-02-02T09:25:42Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-02T09:25:42Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dancer@netfort.gr.jp","avatar":null},"body":"Hi,\n\n>    - Using dashed forms of git commands (e.g. \"git-commit\") from the\n>      command line has been informally deprecated since early 2006, but\n>      now it officially is, and will be removed in the future.  Use\n>      dash-less forms (e.g. \"git commit\") instead.\n\nHmm...\n\nThere are supplimentary tools, such as 'git-dch' and\n'git-buildpackage' which kind of supplied quasi-seamless extention to\ngit family of tools, are they going to be affected in some way?\n\nregards,\n\tjunichi\n-- \ndancer@{debian.org,netfort.gr.jp}   Debian Project\n"},{"id":"67097","messageId":"200802020945.m129jp2V004256@mi1.bluebottle.com","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"7vmyqk563z.fsf@gitster.siamese.dyndns.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"しらいしななこ","fromEmail":"nanako3@bluebottle.com","sentAt":"2008-02-02T09:45:21Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-02T09:45:21Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"nanako3@lavabit.com","avatar":"https://gravatar.com/avatar/3777b9e201c5883a62b1a6fdf7c53f2d712d1d80989146063ea861e33aad72a8?d=mp&s=160"},"body":"Quoting Junio C Hamano <gitster@pobox.com>:\n\n> It has been an unusually long cycle.  5 months since the last\n> feature release 1.5.3 was really a bit too long.\n>\n> But I hope it was worth waiting for.  Thanks everybody for\n> working hard to improve it.\n\nThank *you* for doing superb job maintaining git.\n\n-- \nNanako Shiraishi\nhttp://ivory.ap.teacup.com/nanako3/\n\n----------------------------------------------------------------------\nGet a free email account with anti spam protection.\nhttp://www.bluebottle.com/tag/2\n"},{"id":"67130","messageId":"5F21F8A3-549D-4086-8EB8-76DE0867F3B4@wincent.com","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"7vmyqk563z.fsf@gitster.siamese.dyndns.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Wincent Colaiuta","fromEmail":"win@wincent.com","sentAt":"2008-02-02T12:11:04Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-02T12:11:04Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"greg@hurrell.net","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/7074?v=4"},"body":"El 2/2/2008, a las 5:34, Junio C Hamano escribió:\n\n> The latest feature release GIT 1.5.4 is available at the usual\n> places:\n\nCongratulations to everybody who contributed to this release, and  \nspecial thanks to you Junio for coordinating it all (and contributing  \na large hunk of the code yourself).\n\nCheers,\nWincent\n"},{"id":"67140","messageId":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802021557190.7372@racer.site","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"87k5lnwvzd.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","sentAt":"2008-02-02T15:58:11Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-02T15:58:11Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/127790?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nOn Sat, 2 Feb 2008, Junichi Uekawa wrote:\n\n> >    - Using dashed forms of git commands (e.g. \"git-commit\") from the\n> >      command line has been informally deprecated since early 2006, but\n> >      now it officially is, and will be removed in the future.  Use\n> >      dash-less forms (e.g. \"git commit\") instead.\n> \n> Hmm...\n> \n> There are supplimentary tools, such as 'git-dch' and 'git-buildpackage' \n> which kind of supplied quasi-seamless extention to git family of tools, \n> are they going to be affected in some way?\n\nAFAIU this only affects the programs that git installs.  Of course, git \nwill search in that location first, but then in the rest of PATH.\n\nCiao,\nDscho\n"},{"id":"67164","messageId":"CFB8A272-863C-4758-91F7-E9669D70A200@zib.de","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"7vmyqk563z.fsf@gitster.siamese.dyndns.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Steffen Prohaska","fromEmail":"prohaska@zib.de","sentAt":"2008-02-02T22:42:11Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-02T22:42:11Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"prohaska@zib.de","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/217580?v=4"},"body":"\nOn Feb 2, 2008, at 5:34 AM, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n\n> The latest feature release GIT 1.5.4 is available at the usual\n> places:\n\nThe msysgit setup is available at:\n\n   http://code.google.com/p/msysgit/downloads/\n\n\tSteffen\n"},{"id":"67166","messageId":"878x22j1km.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"87k5lnwvzd.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Junichi Uekawa","fromEmail":"dancer@netfort.gr.jp","sentAt":"2008-02-03T01:00:57Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T01:00:57Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dancer@netfort.gr.jp","avatar":null},"body":"Hi,\n\n\nWhen I was idly googling around for traces of VCS and popularity,\nnoticed that Git is actually pretty popular.  Googling for 'gitweb'\nand 'viewcvs' and other comparative web-frontend variants floating in\nthe cyberspace I get these number of hits (in rough estimate) :\n\n10000000 CVS\n1000000 SVN\n100000 Git\n10000 Mercurial / Darcs\n1000 Bzr\n\nThis is crude, and I'm sure someone else will come up with a better\nestimate. The point is, when there are so many users, people don't\nread the lists or the changelog, but rely on manuals, and be surprised\nwith this change.\n\n\n> >    - Using dashed forms of git commands (e.g. \"git-commit\") from the\n> >      command line has been informally deprecated since early 2006, but\n> >      now it officially is, and will be removed in the future.  Use\n> >      dash-less forms (e.g. \"git commit\") instead.\n\nI was wondering why I use the git-xxx format so much (in muscle, and\nin scripts). And realized I have the following reasons:\n\n1. That's the form documented in the manual pages (generated from asciidoc)\n\n2. That's the name manual pages are in.\n\n3. Linus said it's better (3 years ago), and I thought so too.\n   (Situation has changed, bash has better completion for 'git'\n   commands, so that's no longer valid)\n\n4. There was a GNU Interactive Tools with the same name 'git', so it\nwas better to avoid confusion then. (This is still the case with\nDebian, where the sysadmin can choose whether to make 'git' (GNU\nInteractive Tools) the default, or our beloved git.\n\n5. There are many documentations floating around.\n\n6. I'm used to it.\n\n\nregards,\n\tjunichi\n-- \ndancer@{debian.org,netfort.gr.jp}   Debian Project\n"},{"id":"67173","messageId":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802030210240.7372@racer.site","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"878x22j1km.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","sentAt":"2008-02-03T02:14:37Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T02:14:37Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/127790?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nOn Sun, 3 Feb 2008, Junichi Uekawa wrote:\n\n> I was wondering why I use the git-xxx format so much (in muscle, and\n> in scripts). And realized I have the following reasons:\n> \n> [1 and 2]\n>\n> 3. Linus said it's better (3 years ago), and I thought so too.\n\nThat woul be surprising.  Git was not invented until early April 2005.  At \nthe moment I still wait (impatiently, because then my current contract \nends) for April 2008.\n\nThe important thing to realise is that time is such a wonderful dimension \nto be exposed to: not only do you live (experience things that you did not \nknow before), but also other people live and learn.\n\nIOW even Linus realised that the git-xxx format is not _that_ good.  Which \nis why -- as you should have realised if you did not subscribe 5 minutes \nago -- we do not recommend git-xxx at all, but insist on \"git xxx\".\n\nHth,\nDscho\n"},{"id":"67178","messageId":"877ihmivav.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802030210240.7372@racer.site","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Junichi Uekawa","fromEmail":"dancer@netfort.gr.jp","sentAt":"2008-02-03T03:16:24Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T03:16:24Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dancer@netfort.gr.jp","avatar":null},"body":"Hi,\n\n> That woul be surprising.  Git was not invented until early April 2005.  At \n> the moment I still wait (impatiently, because then my current contract \n> ends) for April 2008.\n> \n> The important thing to realise is that time is such a wonderful dimension \n> to be exposed to: not only do you live (experience things that you did not \n> know before), but also other people live and learn.\n> \n> IOW even Linus realised that the git-xxx format is not _that_ good.  Which \n> is why -- as you should have realised if you did not subscribe 5 minutes \n> ago -- we do not recommend git-xxx at all, but insist on \"git xxx\".\n\nI didn't realize that.\n\nGit doesn't give any warnings, and manpages give the dashed examples\nonly.\n\nAlthough I was subscribed to git-list from day 1, I must admit that\nthese days I don't read this list too closely (hence being caught in\nsurprise at this point).\n\nI assume things started with the following commit; but really, can we\nplease start with some deprecation notice before really moving it\naround in user-visible location.\n\n\n\n\ncommit 36e5e70e0f40cf7ca4351b8159d68f8560a2805f\nAuthor: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>\nDate:   Sat Jun 30 11:49:17 2007 -0700\n\n    Start deprecating \"git-command\" in favor of \"git command\"\n    \n    I realize that a lot of people use the \"git-xyzzy\" format, and we have\n    various historical reasons for it, but I also think that most people have\n    long since started thinking of the git command as a single command with\n    various subcommands, and we've long had the documentation talk about it\n    that way.\n    \n    Slowly migrating away from the git-xyzzy format would allow us to\n    eventually no longer install hundreds of binaries (even if most of them\n    are symlinks or hardlinks) in users $PATH, and the _original_ reasons for\n    it (implementation issues and bash completion) are really long long gone.\n    \n    Using \"git xyzzy\" also has some fundamental advantages, like the ability\n    to specify things like paging (\"git -p xyzzy\") and making the whole notion\n    of aliases act like other git commands (which they already do, but they do\n    *not* have a \"git-xyzzy\" form!)\n    \n    Anyway, while actually removing the \"git-xyzzy\" things is not practical\n    right now, we can certainly start slowly to deprecate it internally inside\n    git itself - in the shell scripts we use, and the test vectors.\n    \n    This patch adds a \"remove-dashes\" makefile target, which does that. It\n    isn't particularly efficient or smart, but it *does* successfully rewrite\n    a lot of our shell scripts to use the \"git xyzzy\" form for all built-in\n    commands.\n    \n    (For non-builtins, the \"git xyzzy\" format implies an extra execve(), so\n    this script leaves those alone).\n    \n    So apply this patch, and then run\n    \n        make remove-dashes\n        make test\n        git commit -a\n    \n    to generate a much larger patch that actually starts this transformation.\n    \n    (The only half-way subtle thing about this is that it also fixes up\n    git-filter-branch.sh for the new world order by adding quoting around\n    the use of \"git-commit-tree\" as an argument. It doesn't need it in that\n    format, but when changed into \"git commit-tree\" it is no longer a single\n    word, and the quoting maintains the old behaviour).\n    \n    NOTE! This does not yet mean that you can actually stop installing the\n    \"git-xyzzy\" binaries for the builtins. There are some remaining places\n    that want to use the old form, this just removes the most obvious ones\n    that can easily be done automatically.\n    \n    Signed-off-by: Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>\n    Signed-off-by: Junio C Hamano <gitster@pobox.com>\n\n\n\n\nregards,\n\tjunichi\n-- \ndancer@{debian.org,netfort.gr.jp}   Debian Project\n"},{"id":"67179","messageId":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802030321150.7372@racer.site","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"877ihmivav.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","sentAt":"2008-02-03T03:24:20Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T03:24:20Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/127790?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nOn Sun, 3 Feb 2008, Junichi Uekawa wrote:\n\n> Hi,\n> \n\nWho said that:\n\n> > That woul be surprising.  Git was not invented until early April 2005.  \n> > At the moment I still wait (impatiently, because then my current \n> > contract ends) for April 2008.\n\nPlease realize that you make it hard on _everybody else_ than you to \nfollow who said what by egoistically deleting things that are important.  \nSuch as who said what.\n\n> > The important thing to realise is that time is such a wonderful \n> > dimension to be exposed to: not only do you live (experience things \n> > that you did not know before), but also other people live and learn.\n> > \n> > IOW even Linus realised that the git-xxx format is not _that_ good.  \n> > Which is why -- as you should have realised if you did not subscribe 5 \n> > minutes ago -- we do not recommend git-xxx at all, but insist on \"git \n> > xxx\".\n> \n> I didn't realize that.\n> \n> Git doesn't give any warnings, and manpages give the dashed examples \n> only.\n> \n> Although I was subscribed to git-list from day 1, I must admit that \n> these days I don't read this list too closely (hence being caught in \n> surprise at this point).\n> \n> I assume things started with the following commit; but really, can we \n> please start with some deprecation notice before really moving it around \n> in user-visible location.\n\nThat deprecation notice was the one you originally replied to.  So your \nrequest has been granted before you even asked for it.\n\nBut I suspect that you did not understand what I said: if you install a \ngit script (that is not part of the \"official\" Git), it will probably be \nin the PATH, and you will not have a problem.\n\nHth,\nDscho\n"},{"id":"67180","messageId":"871w7uitnt.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802030321150.7372@racer.site","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Junichi Uekawa","fromEmail":"dancer@netfort.gr.jp","sentAt":"2008-02-03T03:51:50Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T03:51:50Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dancer@netfort.gr.jp","avatar":null},"body":"Hi,\n\nAt Sun, 3 Feb 2008 03:24:20 +0000 (GMT),\nJohannes Schindelin wrote:\n> That deprecation notice was the one you originally replied to.  So your \n> request has been granted before you even asked for it.\n> \n> But I suspect that you did not understand what I said: if you install a \n> git script (that is not part of the \"official\" Git), it will probably be \n> in the PATH, and you will not have a problem.\n\nThere are two parts to the problem\n\n1. Custom scripts installed in PATH\n   -> this is not a problem\n\n2. Custom scripts calling git tools with dash notation. (git-xxx).\n   -> they need to be modified and fixed.\n\nI was initially worried about (1), but I realize now that it's a\nno-op.  Now, I am worried about (2), and I realize I have quite a few\nscripts to fix.  \n\n\nregards,\n\tjunichi\n-- \ndancer@{debian.org,netfort.gr.jp}   Debian Project\n"},{"id":"67185","messageId":"200802030632.31169.chriscool@tuxfamily.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"871w7uitnt.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Christian Couder","fromEmail":"chriscool@tuxfamily.org","sentAt":"2008-02-03T05:32:31Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T05:32:31Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"christian.couder@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/208954?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nLe dimanche 3 février 2008, Junichi Uekawa a écrit :\n> There are two parts to the problem\n>\n> 1. Custom scripts installed in PATH\n>    -> this is not a problem\n>\n> 2. Custom scripts calling git tools with dash notation. (git-xxx).\n>    -> they need to be modified and fixed.\n>\n> I was initially worried about (1), but I realize now that it's a\n> no-op.  Now, I am worried about (2), and I realize I have quite a few\n> scripts to fix.\n\nIf you have some general purpose scripts that you can put under the GPL, \nthen we can perhaps integrate and fix them for you and everyone else.\n\nThanks in advance,\nChristian.\n"},{"id":"67204","messageId":"20080203103804.GC323@artemis.madism.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"878x22j1km.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Pierre Habouzit","fromEmail":"madcoder@debian.org","sentAt":"2008-02-03T10:38:04Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T10:38:04Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"madcoder@debian.org","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/44708?v=4"},"body":"On Sun, Feb 03, 2008 at 01:00:57AM +0000, Junichi Uekawa wrote:\n> Hi,\n> \n> \n> When I was idly googling around for traces of VCS and popularity,\n> noticed that Git is actually pretty popular.  Googling for 'gitweb'\n> and 'viewcvs' and other comparative web-frontend variants floating in\n> the cyberspace I get these number of hits (in rough estimate) :\n> \n> 10000000 CVS\n> 1000000 SVN\n> 100000 Git\n> 10000 Mercurial / Darcs\n> 1000 Bzr\n> \n> This is crude, and I'm sure someone else will come up with a better\n> estimate. The point is, when there are so many users, people don't\n> read the lists or the changelog, but rely on manuals, and be surprised\n> with this change.\n\n  http://www.google.com/trends?q=svn%2C+git%2C+mercurial%2C+bzr%2C+darcs&ctab=0&geo=all&date=all&sort=0\n\n  :)\n\n> I was wondering why I use the git-xxx format so much (in muscle, and\n> in scripts). And realized I have the following reasons:\n> \n> 1. That's the form documented in the manual pages (generated from asciidoc)\n> \n> 2. That's the name manual pages are in.\n> \n> 3. Linus said it's better (3 years ago), and I thought so too.\n>    (Situation has changed, bash has better completion for 'git'\n>    commands, so that's no longer valid)\n> \n> 4. There was a GNU Interactive Tools with the same name 'git', so it\n> was better to avoid confusion then. (This is still the case with\n> Debian, where the sysadmin can choose whether to make 'git' (GNU\n> Interactive Tools) the default, or our beloved git.\n> \n> 5. There are many documentations floating around.\n> \n> 6. I'm used to it.\n\n  Yes, but your aliases are not usable through git-foo, only git foo is.\nSo for consistency reasons, non dashed versions are better.\n\n  And one could in the future have builtin commands without the\ncorresponding git-foo and git-bar either. I'm thinking\ngit-revert/git-cherry-pick that use _exactly_ the same code and code\nobjects, hence having the two binary is somehow a waste of space.\ngit-log variants are the same, and so on. I'm not saying this _will_ be\ndone, TTBOMK it has not even been discussed, but that may happen at some\npoint.\n\n-- \n·O·  Pierre Habouzit\n··O                                                madcoder@debian.org\nOOO                                                http://www.madism.org\n"},{"id":"67207","messageId":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802031048320.7372@racer.site","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"871w7uitnt.dancerj%dancer@netfort.gr.jp","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","sentAt":"2008-02-03T10:50:02Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T10:50:02Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/127790?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nOn Sun, 3 Feb 2008, Junichi Uekawa wrote:\n\n> 2. Custom scripts calling git tools with dash notation. (git-xxx).\n>    -> they need to be modified and fixed.\n\nExactly, they need to be modified and fixed.  Which was why Junio wrote \nthat part of his message, to warn you and everybody that you will need to \nfix your scripts.  Of course, you need not be in a hurry, this will not \naffect you in the next few weeks.\n\nCiao,\nDscho\n"},{"id":"67212","messageId":"20080203125651.GA18392@mit.edu","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080203103804.GC323@artemis.madism.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Theodore Tso","fromEmail":"tytso@mit.edu","sentAt":"2008-02-03T12:56:51Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T12:56:51Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"tytso@mit.edu","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/51416?v=4"},"body":"On Sun, Feb 03, 2008 at 11:38:04AM +0100, Pierre Habouzit wrote:\n>   http://www.google.com/trends?q=svn%2C+git%2C+mercurial%2C+bzr%2C+darcs&ctab=0&geo=all&date=all&sort=0\n> \n>   :)\n\nUnfortunately the only problem with this trend chart is that if you\ntake the baseline of git and mercurial starting in the time period\nbetween April 2004 and 2005 (i.e., before development of those two\nsystems started), git's and mercurial's usage hasn't actually grown by\nthat much.  The problem being of course that git and mercurial are\nwords that can be used in other contexts, which is somewhat less\nlikely with svn and bzr, which makes it harder to draw good\nconclusions.\n\n\t\t\t\t\t- Ted\n"},{"id":"67217","messageId":"vpqodayrsag.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080203103804.GC323@artemis.madism.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Matthieu Moy","fromEmail":"matthieu.moy@imag.fr","sentAt":"2008-02-03T15:08:55Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T15:08:55Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"git@matthieu-moy.fr","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/14709?v=4"},"body":"Pierre Habouzit <madcoder@debian.org> writes:\n\n> On Sun, Feb 03, 2008 at 01:00:57AM +0000, Junichi Uekawa wrote:\n>> Hi,\n>> \n>> \n>> When I was idly googling around for traces of VCS and popularity,\n>> noticed that Git is actually pretty popular.  Googling for 'gitweb'\n>> and 'viewcvs' and other comparative web-frontend variants floating in\n>> the cyberspace I get these number of hits (in rough estimate) :\n>> \n>> 10000000 CVS\n>> 1000000 SVN\n>> 100000 Git\n>> 10000 Mercurial / Darcs\n>> 1000 Bzr\n>> \n>> This is crude, and I'm sure someone else will come up with a better\n>> estimate. The point is, when there are so many users, people don't\n>> read the lists or the changelog, but rely on manuals, and be surprised\n>> with this change.\n>\n>   http://www.google.com/trends?q=svn%2C+git%2C+mercurial%2C+bzr%2C+darcs&ctab=0&geo=all&date=all&sort=0\n\nDebian's popularity contest gives an idea too:\n\n$ wget 'http://popcon.debian.org/by_inst'\n$ head -11 by_inst\n#Format\n#   \n#<name> is the package name;\n#<inst> is the number of people who installed this package;\n#<vote> is the number of people who use this package regularly;\n#<old> is the number of people who installed, but don't use this package\n#      regularly;\n#<recent> is the number of people who upgraded this package recently;\n#<no-files> is the number of people whose entry didn't contain enough\n#           information (atime and ctime were 0).\n#rank name                            inst  vote   old recent no-files (maintainer)\n$ grep -e ' cvs ' -e ' subversion ' -e ' monotone ' -e ' tla ' -e ' mercurial ' -e ' bzr ' -e ' git-core ' -e ' darcs ' by_inst\n890   cvs                            22659  4326 12754  5576     3 (Steve Mcintyre)                \n940   subversion                     18888  7630  9693  1560     5 (Peter Samuelson)               \n2423  git-core                        3720  1858   992   870     0 (Gerrit Pape)                   \n3480  mercurial                       1778   410   914   454     0 (Vincent Danjean)               \n3989  darcs                           1344   300   936   108     0 (Isaac Jones)                   \n4232  bzr                             1198   278   372   548     0 (Debian Bazaar Maintainers)     \n4500  tla                             1067   158   830    79     0 (Adam Majer)                    \n7363  monotone                         417    96   277    44     0 (Debian Maintainers For Monotone)\n\nThat's not far from the first estimation above, except that Debian\nusers seem to have abandonned CVS a bit quicker than the rest of the\nworld. Git is still far behind SVN, but also by far the most popular\nof free distributed VCS, modulo the fact that 78.42% of statistics are\nbiaised ;-).\n\n-- \nMatthieu\n"},{"id":"67220","messageId":"fo4muj$fek$1@ger.gmane.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"vpqodayrsag.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4 (git popularity)","fromName":"Jakub Narebski","fromEmail":"jnareb@gmail.com","sentAt":"2008-02-03T15:34:42Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T15:34:42Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jnareb@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/2706?v=4"},"body":"Matthieu Moy wrote:\n> Pierre Habouzit <madcoder@debian.org> writes:\n>> On Sun, Feb 03, 2008 at 01:00:57AM +0000, Junichi Uekawa wrote:\n>>> \n>>> When I was idly googling around for traces of VCS and popularity,\n>>> noticed that Git is actually pretty popular.  Googling for 'gitweb'\n>>> and 'viewcvs' and other comparative web-frontend variants floating in\n>>> the cyberspace I get these number of hits (in rough estimate) :\n>>> \n>>> 10000000 CVS\n>>> 1000000 SVN\n>>> 100000 Git\n>>> 10000 Mercurial / Darcs\n>>> 1000 Bzr\n>>> \n>>> This is crude, and I'm sure someone else will come up with a better\n>>> estimate. The point is, when there are so many users, people don't\n>>> read the lists or the changelog, but rely on manuals, and be surprised\n>>> with this change.\n>>\n>>   http://www.google.com/trends?q=svn%2C+git%2C+mercurial%2C+bzr%2C+darcs&ctab=0&geo=all&date=all&sort=0\n> \n> Debian's popularity contest gives an idea too\n\nAnd Ohloh stack count gives yet another idea.  Both Debian popularity\ncounter and number of Ohloh stacks are mentioned in GitSurvey2007[*1*],\naround question about used SCMs.  Google Trends above not yet, and\nperhaps will not because it is even more skewed than mentioned results,\nperhaps even more than result of Git _User's_ Survey 2007.\n\n[*1*] http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/GitSurvey2007#head-4ed59e7615e2dc4f4baa8fa0beccde52c93789f8\n-- \nJakub Narebski\nWarsaw, Poland\nShadeHawk on #git\n"},{"id":"67242","messageId":"20080203175534.GT29522@dpotapov.dyndns.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"7vmyqk563z.fsf@gitster.siamese.dyndns.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Dmitry Potapov","fromEmail":"dpotapov@gmail.com","sentAt":"2008-02-03T17:55:35Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T17:55:35Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dpotapov@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/6568595?v=4"},"body":"On Fri, Feb 01, 2008 at 08:34:24PM -0800, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n> The latest feature release GIT 1.5.4 is available at the usual\n> places:\n\nCongratulation to all Git developers and special thanks to Junio Hamano\nwhose dedication and efforts cannot be overestimated. GIT 1.5.4 may not\nappear a big step in terms of version numbers, but it is really a big\nstep in making GIT even much more user friendly. Thanks to everyone who\ncontributed to this release.\n\nDmitry\n"},{"id":"67252","messageId":"20080203192758.GD18392@mit.edu","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"vpqodayrsag.fsf@bauges.imag.fr","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Theodore Tso","fromEmail":"tytso@mit.edu","sentAt":"2008-02-03T19:27:58Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-03T19:27:58Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"tytso@mit.edu","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/51416?v=4"},"body":"On Sun, Feb 03, 2008 at 04:08:55PM +0100, Matthieu Moy wrote:\n> Debian's popularity contest gives an idea too:\n> \n> #rank name                            inst  vote   old recent no-files (maintainer)\n> 2423  git-core                        3720  1858   992   870     0 (Gerrit Pape)                   \n> 3480  mercurial                       1778   410   914   454     0 (Vincent Danjean)               \n> 4232  bzr                             1198   278   372   548     0 (Debian Bazaar Maintainers)     \n\nThat's very interesting.  When I did a count a month or so ago of the\nnumber of projects using git, mercurial and bzr as self reported on\neach of the project's wiki's, what I found then was:\n\ngit 115  (source: http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/GitProjects)\nhg   89  (source: http://www.selenic.com/mercurial/wiki/index.cgi/ProjectsUsingMercurial)\nbzr  48  (source: http://bazaar-vcs.org/WhoUsesBzr)\n\nOf course, there's no guarantee that each of the Wiki maintainers were\nas diligent about putting references to all of the projects, but to\nthe extent that there are people in each user community who are\ninterested in advocacy of their favoriate SCM, I would have expected\nat least some baseline amount of effort in keeping their wiki's\nuptodate.  So it's not interesting as another data point...\n\n\t      \t       \t\t      \t      - Ted\n"},{"id":"67416","messageId":"y7a0zcgm.fsf@blue.sea.net","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080203192758.GD18392@mit.edu","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Jari Aalto","fromEmail":"jari.aalto@cante.net","sentAt":"2008-02-04T20:35:53Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-04T20:35:53Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jari.aalto@cante.net","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/34601?v=4"},"body":"* Sun 2008-02-03 Theodore Tso <tytso@mit.edu> gmane.comp.version-control.git\n* Message-Id: 20080203192758.GD18392@mit.edu\n> On Sun, Feb 03, 2008 at 04:08:55PM +0100, Matthieu Moy wrote:\n>\n> git 115  (source: http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/GitProjects)\n> hg   89  (source: http://www.selenic.com/mercurial/wiki/index.cgi/ProjectsUsingMercurial)\n> bzr  48  (source: http://bazaar-vcs.org/WhoUsesBzr)\n>\n\nDebian project is also using these:\n\n    Hg      http://git.debian.org\n    Bzr     http://bzr.debian.org\n    Git     http//hg.debian.org\n    Darcs   http://darcs.debian.org\n\nJari\n\nReferences:\n\n    http://wiki.debian.org/Alioth/Hg\n    http://wiki.debian.org/Alioth/Bzr\n    http://wiki.debian.org/Alioth/Git\n    http://wiki.debian.org/Alioth/Darcs\n\n-- \nWelcome to FOSS revolution: we fix and modify until it shines\n"},{"id":"67784","messageId":"20080207123108.GA12009@bit.office.eurotux.com","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"CFB8A272-863C-4758-91F7-E9669D70A200@zib.de","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Luciano Rocha","fromEmail":"luciano@eurotux.com","sentAt":"2008-02-07T12:31:09Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T12:31:09Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"luciano@eurotux.com","avatar":null},"body":"On Sat, Feb 02, 2008 at 11:42:11PM +0100, Steffen Prohaska wrote:\n> \n>  On Feb 2, 2008, at 5:34 AM, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n> \n> > The latest feature release GIT 1.5.4 is available at the usual\n> > places:\n> \n>  The msysgit setup is available at:\n> \n>    http://code.google.com/p/msysgit/downloads/\n> \n\nWhy do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n\nOnly the \"NO WARRANTY ...\" should be required, GPL is only required for\ndistribution (and you could make that information available at install).\n\n-- \nLuciano Rocha <luciano@eurotux.com>\nEurotux Informática, S.A. <http://www.eurotux.com/>\n"},{"id":"67791","messageId":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071255110.8543@racer.site","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080207123108.GA12009@bit.office.eurotux.com","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","sentAt":"2008-02-07T12:55:58Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T12:55:58Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/127790?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nOn Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n\n> On Sat, Feb 02, 2008 at 11:42:11PM +0100, Steffen Prohaska wrote:\n> > \n> >  On Feb 2, 2008, at 5:34 AM, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n> > \n> > > The latest feature release GIT 1.5.4 is available at the usual\n> > > places:\n> > \n> >  The msysgit setup is available at:\n> > \n> >    http://code.google.com/p/msysgit/downloads/\n> > \n> \n> Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n\nBecause that's the only license you have to use git.\n\nGet over it, or use another SCM,\nDscho \"who hates license wars\"\n"},{"id":"67794","messageId":"20080207130715.GA14000@bit.office.eurotux.com","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071255110.8543@racer.site","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Luciano Rocha","fromEmail":"luciano@eurotux.com","sentAt":"2008-02-07T13:07:15Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T13:07:15Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"luciano@eurotux.com","avatar":null},"body":"On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 12:55:58PM +0000, Johannes Schindelin wrote:\n> Hi,\n> \n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n> \n> > On Sat, Feb 02, 2008 at 11:42:11PM +0100, Steffen Prohaska wrote:\n> > > \n> > >  On Feb 2, 2008, at 5:34 AM, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n> > > \n> > > > The latest feature release GIT 1.5.4 is available at the usual\n> > > > places:\n> > > \n> > >  The msysgit setup is available at:\n> > > \n> > >    http://code.google.com/p/msysgit/downloads/\n> > > \n> > \n> > Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n> \n> Because that's the only license you have to use git.\n\nAgain, GPL governs distribution, not use.\n\n> Get over it, or use another SCM,\n\nI like and use GPL, but I won't force my users to accept the GPL in\norder to use programs released under it.\n\n> Dscho \"who hates license wars\"\n\nI'm not battling over licenses.\n\n-- \nLuciano Rocha <luciano@eurotux.com>\nEurotux Informática, S.A. <http://www.eurotux.com/>\n"},{"id":"67796","messageId":"5157060E-A310-456B-96DE-7F9DF7CE7D05@orakel.ntnu.no","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071255110.8543-OGWIkrnhIhzN0uC3ymp8PA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Eyvind Bernhardsen","fromEmail":"eyvind-git-a1zfcjasw2ztqyr7fv3ouw@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T13:23:52Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T13:23:52Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"eyvind-git-a1zfcjasw2ztqyr7fv3ouw@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nOn 7. feb.. 2008, at 13.55, Johannes Schindelin wrote:\n\n> Hi,\n>\n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n>\n>> Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n>\n> Because that's the only license you have to use git.\n\nI think his point is that you don't need to \"accept\" anything to be  \nallowed to use GPLed software. Presenting the GPL as a click-through  \nlicence on installation implies that you should read it carefully to  \nsee what limits are imposed on you, when in fact the GPL explicitly  \nallows you to \"run the program, for any purpose\" (http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html \n).\n\n> Get over it, or use another SCM,\n> Dscho \"who hates license wars\"\n\nNo war for you!\n\nEyvind Bernhardsen\n"},{"id":"67797","messageId":"86k5lguce2.fsf@lola.quinscape.zz","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071255110.8543@racer.site","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"David Kastrup","fromEmail":"dak@gnu.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T13:25:25Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T13:25:25Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dak@gnu.org","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/52141349?v=4"},"body":"Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de> writes:\n\n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n>\n>> On Sat, Feb 02, 2008 at 11:42:11PM +0100, Steffen Prohaska wrote:\n>> > \n>> >  On Feb 2, 2008, at 5:34 AM, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n>> > \n>> > > The latest feature release GIT 1.5.4 is available at the usual\n>> > > places:\n>> > \n>> >  The msysgit setup is available at:\n>> > \n>> >    http://code.google.com/p/msysgit/downloads/\n>> > \n>> \n>> Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n>\n> Because that's the only license you have to use git.\n\nUh no.  The right to use git is \"fair use\": if you have acquired a copy\nof a copyrighted work through a legal channel, you have prima facie a\ncertain set of rights.  Conventional software \"licenses\" try to make you\ngive up many of these rights which is why the recipient needs to agree\nto those licenses (which are actually contracts rather than licenses).\n\nBut the GPL just grants additional rights, so no agreement is necessary\nfor fair use.  From the GPL 2.1 (please read the first sentence in\nparticular):\n\n    Activities other than copying, distribution and modification are not\n    covered by this License; they are outside its scope.  The act of\n    running the Program is not restricted, and the output from the Program\n    is covered only if its contents constitute a work based on the\n    Program (independent of having been made by running the Program).\n    Whether that is true depends on what the Program does.\n\n-- \nDavid Kastrup\n"},{"id":"67798","messageId":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071324460.8543@racer.site","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080207130715.GA14000@bit.office.eurotux.com","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","sentAt":"2008-02-07T13:28:06Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T13:28:06Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/127790?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nOn Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n\n> On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 12:55:58PM +0000, Johannes Schindelin wrote:\n> \n> > On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n> > \n> > > Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n> > \n> > Because that's the only license you have to use git.\n> \n> Again, GPL governs distribution, not use.\n\nThe fine points on why installing it onto your computer is not a \ndistribution are just lost on me.\n\nBesides, if you do not like that our installer shows the GPL, just go and \nmake your own (but be sure to shell out money to your lawyer of choice to \nconfirm that the GPL allows you to do that).\n\nThe Git installer of msysGit will always show the GPL, and have the user \naccept it.\n\n'nuff said,\nDscho\n"},{"id":"67801","messageId":"867ihgubk5.fsf@lola.quinscape.zz","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071324460.8543@racer.site","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"David Kastrup","fromEmail":"dak@gnu.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T13:43:22Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T13:43:22Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dak@gnu.org","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/52141349?v=4"},"body":"Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de> writes:\n\n> Hi,\n>\n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n>\n>> On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 12:55:58PM +0000, Johannes Schindelin wrote:\n>> \n>> > On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n>> > \n>> > > Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n>> > \n>> > Because that's the only license you have to use git.\n>> \n>> Again, GPL governs distribution, not use.\n>\n> The fine points on why installing it onto your computer is not a \n> distribution are just lost on me.\n\nThe GPLv3 might explain it better.\n\n> Besides, if you do not like that our installer shows the GPL, just go\n> and make your own (but be sure to shell out money to your lawyer of\n> choice to confirm that the GPL allows you to do that).\n>\n> The Git installer of msysGit will always show the GPL, and have the\n> user accept it.\n\nWhat happens if the user does not accept it?  The license explicitly\nstates\n\n    Activities other than copying, distribution and modification are not\n    covered by this License; they are outside its scope.  The act of\n    running the Program is not restricted, [...]\n\nObviously, one can't run the program without installing it.  The license\nalso states:\n\n      5. You are not required to accept this License, since you have not\n    signed it.  However, nothing else grants you permission to modify or\n    distribute the Program or its derivative works.  These actions are\n    prohibited by law if you do not accept this License.  Therefore, by\n    modifying or distributing the Program (or any work based on the\n    Program), you indicate your acceptance of this License to do so, and\n    all its terms and conditions for copying, distributing or modifying\n    the Program or works based on it.\n\nAgain, only modification and distribution are affected by\nnon-acceptance.  Talking about unrestricted running of the program would\nbe utterly non-sensical if you were not allowed to install it.\n\nOf course, you can read this in the GPL FAQ if you want to.  There was a\nsimilar problem for the Windows installer of Emacs IIRC (the underlying\nprogram does not even consider the possibility of not agreeing to a\nlicense) and there were proposals of changing the button texts to \"This\nis great\" and something else.  I don't know what the people converged on\nfinally, not using Windows myself.\n\n-- \nDavid Kastrup\n"},{"id":"67803","messageId":"08627A28-85DE-4E58-9DBA-9463A0D1DC1C@zib.de","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071324460.8543-OGWIkrnhIhzN0uC3ymp8PA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Steffen Prohaska","fromEmail":"prohaska-wjoc1khpmeg@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T13:53:30Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T13:53:30Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"prohaska-wjoc1khpmeg@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\n\nOn Feb 7, 2008, at 2:28 PM, Johannes Schindelin wrote:\n\n> The Git installer of msysGit will always show the GPL, and have the  \n> user\n> accept it.\n\nI agree.\n\n\tSteffen\n"},{"id":"67804","messageId":"8763x07thd.fsf@graviton.dyn.troilus.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"86k5lguce2.fsf-Gv3ZRPJT63HkqtzbHXq1RqVXKuFTiq87@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Michael Poole","fromEmail":"mdpoole-izmaev5cut1afugrpc6u6w@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T14:04:46Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T14:04:46Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"mdpoole-izmaev5cut1afugrpc6u6w@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nDavid Kastrup writes:\n\n> Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin-Mmb7MZpHnFY@public.gmane.org> writes:\n>\n>> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n>>\n>>> On Sat, Feb 02, 2008 at 11:42:11PM +0100, Steffen Prohaska wrote:\n>>> > \n>>> >  On Feb 2, 2008, at 5:34 AM, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n>>> > \n>>> > > The latest feature release GIT 1.5.4 is available at the usual\n>>> > > places:\n>>> > \n>>> >  The msysgit setup is available at:\n>>> > \n>>> >    http://code.google.com/p/msysgit/downloads/\n>>> > \n>>> \n>>> Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n>>\n>> Because that's the only license you have to use git.\n>\n> Uh no.  The right to use git is \"fair use\": if you have acquired a copy\n> of a copyrighted work through a legal channel, you have prima facie a\n> certain set of rights.  Conventional software \"licenses\" try to make you\n> give up many of these rights which is why the recipient needs to agree\n> to those licenses (which are actually contracts rather than licenses).\n\nThe concept of \"fair use\" of copyrighted works does not exist (per se)\nin Europe, Japan, or a number of other countries.  The USA may be the\nonly place to have that doctrine.\n\nBritish courts, for instance, have held that copying a program into\nRAM for the purposes of executing it is a right reserved under\ncopyright law.  In the US, 17 USC 117(c) and (d) were added after a\ncourt held (in MAI Sys. Corp. v. Peak Computer) that a computer repair\ncompany violated copyright of software that automatically started on a\ncomputer it was asked to repair -- by simply allowing the computer to\nboot and execute that program automatically.\n\nAs the GPL itself notes, you are not required to accept it, but\nnothing else grants you the right to perform actions reserved to\ncopyright holders with respect to the work.  Asking end users to\naccept the GPL has good effect in countries besides the US, and has no\nobvious harm in the US.\n\nMichael Poole\n"},{"id":"67806","messageId":"86tzkksuua.fsf@lola.quinscape.zz","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"8763x07thd.fsf@graviton.dyn.troilus.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"David Kastrup","fromEmail":"dak-mxxj517/zsq@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T14:29:49Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T14:29:49Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dak-mxxj517/zsq@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nMichael Poole <mdpoole-IZmAEv5cUt1AfugRpC6u6w@public.gmane.org> writes:\n\n> British courts, for instance, have held that copying a program into\n> RAM for the purposes of executing it is a right reserved under\n> copyright law.  In the US, 17 USC 117(c) and (d) were added after a\n> court held (in MAI Sys. Corp. v. Peak Computer) that a computer repair\n> company violated copyright of software that automatically started on a\n> computer it was asked to repair -- by simply allowing the computer to\n> boot and execute that program automatically.\n>\n> As the GPL itself notes, you are not required to accept it, but\n> nothing else grants you the right to perform actions reserved to\n> copyright holders with respect to the work.\n\nI think that most countries will grant some right to the purchaser of a\nphysical copy of copyrighted material.  For example, I doubt there are\ncountries where it is prohibited to read a book you have bought (via a\nchannel authorized by the copyright holder) when it contains no explicit\nlicense granting you the right to read it.\n\n-- \nDavid Kastrup\n"},{"id":"67813","messageId":"alpine.LFD.1.00.0802070949460.2732@xanadu.home","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080207130715.GA14000-oEplIgxCSygGFt9iVWuREaMaJEuR8uiQ@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Nicolas Pitre","fromEmail":"nico-mo2vmkxb4k0@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T14:53:05Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T14:53:05Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"nico-mo2vmkxb4k0@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nOn Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n\n> On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 12:55:58PM +0000, Johannes Schindelin wrote:\n> > Hi,\n> > \n> > On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n> > \n> > > Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n> > \n> > Because that's the only license you have to use git.\n> \n> Again, GPL governs distribution, not use.\n> \n> > Get over it, or use another SCM,\n> \n> I like and use GPL, but I won't force my users to accept the GPL in\n> order to use programs released under it.\n\nWhat are they forced into if they indeed only want to _use_ Git?\n\nThey nevertheless must be made aware of the rules they have to follow in \ncase the idea of redistributing it crosses their mind.\n\n\nNicolas\n"},{"id":"67814","messageId":"20080207155946.GA20459@bit.office.eurotux.com","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LFD.1.00.0802070949460.2732@xanadu.home","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Luciano Rocha","fromEmail":"luciano@eurotux.com","sentAt":"2008-02-07T15:59:46Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T15:59:46Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"luciano@eurotux.com","avatar":null},"body":"On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:53:05AM -0500, Nicolas Pitre wrote:\n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n> \n> > On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 12:55:58PM +0000, Johannes Schindelin wrote:\n> > > Hi,\n> > > \n> > > On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n> > > \n> > > > Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n> > > \n> > > Because that's the only license you have to use git.\n> > \n> > Again, GPL governs distribution, not use.\n> > \n> > > Get over it, or use another SCM,\n> > \n> > I like and use GPL, but I won't force my users to accept the GPL in\n> > order to use programs released under it.\n> \n> What are they forced into if they indeed only want to _use_ Git?\n\nThe msys git installer forces me to accept the GNU GPL in order to\nproceed.\n\nOf course, I can use another installer, or compile my own set of\nbinaries. I just wanted to bring that case to attention, nothing else.\n\n> They nevertheless must be made aware of the rules they have to follow in \n> case the idea of redistributing it crosses their mind.\n\nI don't dispute that, only that I can't continue with the install unless\nI click on \"I Accept\" to the GNU GPL.\n\n-- \nLuciano Rocha <luciano@eurotux.com>\nEurotux Informática, S.A. <http://www.eurotux.com/>\n"},{"id":"67815","messageId":"87sl0469gb.fsf@graviton.dyn.troilus.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"86tzkksuua.fsf-Gv3ZRPJT63HkqtzbHXq1RqVXKuFTiq87@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Michael Poole","fromEmail":"mdpoole-izmaev5cut1afugrpc6u6w@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T16:02:44Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T16:02:44Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"mdpoole-izmaev5cut1afugrpc6u6w@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nDavid Kastrup writes:\n\n> I think that most countries will grant some right to the purchaser of a\n> physical copy of copyrighted material.  For example, I doubt there are\n> countries where it is prohibited to read a book you have bought (via a\n> channel authorized by the copyright holder) when it contains no explicit\n> license granting you the right to read it.\n\nI see two serious dis-analogies here:\n\nHow many users of msysgit purchase a physical copy of it?  (I suspect\nthis is a relevant difference in the US due to its commerce codes, and\nmaybe in other common law countries; it probably is not so important\nin civil law countries, where exchange of consideration is not a\nrequirement to form a contract.)\n\nReading a literary work is typically not a reserved right, either;\nwhile it seems good to treat executing a computer program in the same\nway as reading a book, all copyright regimes that I know of give\nconsideration to the copy that is made to RAM for most computers.  (I\nwill ignore the implications for devices that have execute-in-place\nnon-volatile memory -- I am not a lawyer, and those devices are\nprobably too new to be addressed by courts yet.)\n\nMichael Poole\n\n[Also- The git list did not receive my previous mail and probably will\nnot receive this one either.  vger.kernel.org issues a bogus bounce,\nshown in part below.  I apologize for hijacking the thread this way,\nbut mail to postmaster-at-vger bounces for the same reason.\n\nError in \"rcvdfrom\" envelope address:\n\n\t75.145.205-121-BusName-sterling.va.richmond.hfc.comcastbusiness.net!^Q\n\t^\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t    ^-illegal control character\n\t \\-Extraneous program text\n\n.. where my mail host does not use that name for any reason; vger\nseems to be doing a DNS PTR lookup, then mangling the response.]\n"},{"id":"67818","messageId":"fofalu$gpo$1@ger.gmane.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080207155946.GA20459@bit.office.eurotux.com","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Jakub Narebski","fromEmail":"jnareb@gmail.com","sentAt":"2008-02-07T16:12:45Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T16:12:45Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jnareb@gmail.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/2706?v=4"},"body":"Luciano Rocha wrote:\n> On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:53:05AM -0500, Nicolas Pitre wrote:\n>> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote: \n\n>>> I like and use GPL, but I won't force my users to accept the GPL in\n>>> order to use programs released under it.\n>> \n>> What are they forced into if they indeed only want to _use_ Git?\n> \n> The msys git installer forces me to accept the GNU GPL in order to\n> proceed.\n> \n> Of course, I can use another installer, or compile my own set of\n> binaries. I just wanted to bring that case to attention, nothing else.\n> \n>> They nevertheless must be made aware of the rules they have to follow in \n>> case the idea of redistributing it crosses their mind.\n> \n> I don't dispute that, only that I can't continue with the install unless\n> I click on \"I Accept\" to the GNU GPL.\n\nSo, would you prefer to be presented with GNU GPL with two buttons:\n\"That's great\" and \"Oh, f**k\", instead of \"I Accept\" and \"Cancel\",\nboth of which would allow to install msysGit? ;-ppppppp\n\n-- \nJakub Narebski\nWarsaw, Poland\nShadeHawk on #git\n"},{"id":"67819","messageId":"86abmcsq0u.fsf@lola.quinscape.zz","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"87sl0469gb.fsf@graviton.dyn.troilus.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"David Kastrup","fromEmail":"dak-mxxj517/zsq@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T16:13:53Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T16:13:53Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dak-mxxj517/zsq@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nMichael Poole <mdpoole-IZmAEv5cUt1AfugRpC6u6w@public.gmane.org> writes:\n\n> David Kastrup writes:\n>\n>> I think that most countries will grant some right to the purchaser of\n>> a physical copy of copyrighted material.  For example, I doubt there\n>> are countries where it is prohibited to read a book you have bought\n>> (via a channel authorized by the copyright holder) when it contains\n>> no explicit license granting you the right to read it.\n>\n> I see two serious dis-analogies here:\n>\n> How many users of msysgit purchase a physical copy of it?\n\n\"Acquire an authorized copy\" is the relevant phrase here.  And that will\nbe the case for pretty much every user.\n\n> \t75.145.205-121-BusName-sterling.va.richmond.hfc.comcastbusiness.net!^Q\n> \t^\t\t\t\t\t\t\t\t    ^-illegal control character\n> \t \\-Extraneous program text\n>\n> .. where my mail host does not use that name for any reason; vger\n> seems to be doing a DNS PTR lookup, then mangling the response.]\n\nIt may be that your version of Emacs is injecting C-d characters after\ncolumn 255 in a line.\n\n-- \nDavid Kastrup\n"},{"id":"67820","messageId":"861w7ospoq.fsf@lola.quinscape.zz","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"fofalu$gpo$1@ger.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"David Kastrup","fromEmail":"dak@gnu.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T16:21:09Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T16:21:09Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dak@gnu.org","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/52141349?v=4"},"body":"Jakub Narebski <jnareb@gmail.com> writes:\n\n> Luciano Rocha wrote:\n>> On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:53:05AM -0500, Nicolas Pitre wrote:\n>>> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote: \n>\n>>>> I like and use GPL, but I won't force my users to accept the GPL in\n>>>> order to use programs released under it.\n>>> \n>>> What are they forced into if they indeed only want to _use_ Git?\n>> \n>> The msys git installer forces me to accept the GNU GPL in order to\n>> proceed.\n>> \n>> Of course, I can use another installer, or compile my own set of\n>> binaries. I just wanted to bring that case to attention, nothing else.\n>> \n>>> They nevertheless must be made aware of the rules they have to follow in \n>>> case the idea of redistributing it crosses their mind.\n>> \n>> I don't dispute that, only that I can't continue with the install unless\n>> I click on \"I Accept\" to the GNU GPL.\n>\n> So, would you prefer to be presented with GNU GPL with two buttons:\n> \"That's great\" and \"Oh, f**k\", instead of \"I Accept\" and \"Cancel\",\n> both of which would allow to install msysGit? ;-ppppppp\n\n\"That's great\" and \"I don't mind\" would probably be more appropriate.\nIf the installer will have one button abort, the easiest solution would\nbe probably to offer\n\n\"Continue\" \"Abort\"\n\nThat shows what will happen when clicking the respective button without\ninsinuating legal repercussions.\n\n-- \nDavid Kastrup\n"},{"id":"67821","messageId":"alpine.LFD.1.00.0802071133230.2732@xanadu.home","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080207155946.GA20459-oEplIgxCSygGFt9iVWuREaMaJEuR8uiQ@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Nicolas Pitre","fromEmail":"nico-mo2vmkxb4k0@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T16:35:40Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T16:35:40Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"nico-mo2vmkxb4k0@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nOn Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n\n> On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:53:05AM -0500, Nicolas Pitre wrote:\n> > What are they forced into if they indeed only want to _use_ Git?\n> \n> The msys git installer forces me to accept the GNU GPL in order to\n> proceed.\n> \n> Of course, I can use another installer, or compile my own set of\n> binaries. I just wanted to bring that case to attention, nothing else.\n> \n> > They nevertheless must be made aware of the rules they have to follow in \n> > case the idea of redistributing it crosses their mind.\n> \n> I don't dispute that, only that I can't continue with the install unless\n> I click on \"I Accept\" to the GNU GPL.\n\nThen, simply changing the button text from \"I accept\" to \"Continue\" \nshould be OK?\n\n\nNicolas\n"},{"id":"67833","messageId":"86r6fora6h.fsf@lola.quinscape.zz","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LFD.1.00.0802071133230.2732@xanadu.home","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"David Kastrup","fromEmail":"dak-mxxj517/zsq@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T16:41:26Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T16:41:26Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dak-mxxj517/zsq@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nNicolas Pitre <nico-mo2vmkxb4K0@public.gmane.org> writes:\n\n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n>\n>> On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:53:05AM -0500, Nicolas Pitre wrote:\n>> > What are they forced into if they indeed only want to _use_ Git?\n>> \n>> The msys git installer forces me to accept the GNU GPL in order to\n>> proceed.\n>> \n>> Of course, I can use another installer, or compile my own set of\n>> binaries. I just wanted to bring that case to attention, nothing else.\n>> \n>> > They nevertheless must be made aware of the rules they have to follow in \n>> > case the idea of redistributing it crosses their mind.\n>> \n>> I don't dispute that, only that I can't continue with the install unless\n>> I click on \"I Accept\" to the GNU GPL.\n>\n> Then, simply changing the button text from \"I accept\" to \"Continue\" \n> should be OK?\n\nAnother rather neutral option would be the choice \"Abort\"/\"Install\".\n\n-- \nDavid Kastrup\n"},{"id":"67834","messageId":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071651440.8543@racer.site","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LFD.1.00.0802071133230.2732-QuJgVwGFrdf/9pzu0YdTqQ@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin-mmb7mzphnfy@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T16:53:43Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T16:53:43Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin-mmb7mzphnfy@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nHi,\n\nOn Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Nicolas Pitre wrote:\n\n> Then, simply changing the button text from \"I accept\" to \"Continue\" \n> should be OK?\n\nI consider this bike-shedding, git-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org being the wrong mailing \nlist to discuss this (and as a matter of fact, the msysgit list is also \nnot the correct forum for discussing such legal/personal issues), and \nbesides, the msysgit installer will not be changed in this respect.\n\nHth,\nDscho\n"},{"id":"67835","messageId":"FBE31353-CEB6-4563-AE5F-866D23D129EC@zib.de","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080207155946.GA20459-oEplIgxCSygGFt9iVWuREaMaJEuR8uiQ@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Steffen Prohaska","fromEmail":"prohaska-wjoc1khpmeg@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T17:01:26Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T17:01:26Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"prohaska-wjoc1khpmeg@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\n\nOn Feb 7, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n\n>> They nevertheless must be made aware of the rules they have to  \n>> follow in\n>> case the idea of redistributing it crosses their mind.\n>\n> I don't dispute that, only that I can't continue with the install  \n> unless\n> I click on \"I Accept\" to the GNU GPL.\n\nSimple question: Do you accept it or not?\n\n\tSteffen\n"},{"id":"67836","messageId":"86myqcr8ll.fsf@lola.quinscape.zz","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"FBE31353-CEB6-4563-AE5F-866D23D129EC@zib.de","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"David Kastrup","fromEmail":"dak-mxxj517/zsq@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T17:15:34Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T17:15:34Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dak-mxxj517/zsq@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nSteffen Prohaska <prohaska-wjoc1KHpMeg@public.gmane.org> writes:\n\n> On Feb 7, 2008, at 4:59 PM, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n>\n>>> They nevertheless must be made aware of the rules they have to\n>>> follow in\n>>> case the idea of redistributing it crosses their mind.\n>>\n>> I don't dispute that, only that I can't continue with the install\n>> unless\n>> I click on \"I Accept\" to the GNU GPL.\n>\n> Simple question: Do you accept it or not?\n\nIt's not related to whether GPLed software is permitted to be installed\nor not.  You could also ask \"Do you like green eggs and ham?\".  Where is\nthe point?\n\n-- \nDavid Kastrup\n"},{"id":"67837","messageId":"7v1w7ooes3.fsf@gitster.siamese.dyndns.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071324460.8543-OGWIkrnhIhzN0uC3ymp8PA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Junio C Hamano","fromEmail":"gitster-e+axbwqsrlaavxtiumwx3w@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T17:30:20Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T17:30:20Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"gitster-e+axbwqsrlaavxtiumwx3w@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nJohannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin-Mmb7MZpHnFY@public.gmane.org> writes:\n\n> Besides, if you do not like that our installer shows the GPL, just go and \n> make your own (but be sure to shell out money to your lawyer of choice to \n> confirm that the GPL allows you to do that).\n>\n> The Git installer of msysGit will always show the GPL, and have the user \n> accept it.\n\nI may be missing the details because I do not do Windows myself,\nbut if you are discussing the \"end user binary distribution\"\none, then I think:\n\n * It is a mistake if you do not to show GPL, as you are\n   redistributing GPL code in a binary form and you need to tell\n   the end user his rights (e.g. he can request source for it,\n   the source is found at a well known location, etc.)\n\n * The restriction on redistribution of modified program would\n   probably not apply (unless the receiver hacks binary) to most\n   casual users, so making the label say \"I Accept\" feels a bit\n   silly (but still is technically correct).  As Nico suggested,\n   \"Continue\" may be fine here, as long as the message already\n   says \"this program is distributed under this license you are\n   looking at\".\n\nI recall you had another installer that gives the full\ndevelopment environment for hack on \"git\" with a clone of the\ngit repository.  I do not know if you still offer that\ninstaller, but \"I Accept\" would be very appropriate for that\none.\n"},{"id":"67839","messageId":"y79wvdrd.fsf@blue.sea.net","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071255110.8543@racer.site","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Jari Aalto","fromEmail":"jari.aalto@cante.net","sentAt":"2008-02-07T18:10:30Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T18:10:30Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jari.aalto@cante.net","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/34601?v=4"},"body":"* Thu 2008-02-07 Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de>\n* Message-Id: alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071255110.8543@racer.site\n>> \n>> Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n>\n> Because that's the only license you have to use git.\n\nI don't quite understand.\n\n- When you install a GPL program in Linux (trough package manager).\n  It gets installed.\n- When git is installed Under Windows / Cygwin, it gets installed.\n\n... and if the git is installed trough windows installer, you need\nto *accept* the install?\n\nI really don't follow why there is need to force Windows type EULA\nquestions through the end users' throat in that particular case, when it\nis not done in other cases.\n\nJari\n\n-- \nWelcome to FOSS revolution: we fix and modify until it shines\n"},{"id":"67841","messageId":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071831520.8543@racer.site","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"7v1w7ooes3.fsf-jO8aZxhGsIagbBziECNbOZn29agUkmeCHZ5vskTnxNA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin-mmb7mzphnfy@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T18:40:28Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T18:40:28Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin-mmb7mzphnfy@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nHi,\n\nOn Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n\n> Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin-Mmb7MZpHnFY@public.gmane.org> writes:\n> \n> > Besides, if you do not like that our installer shows the GPL, just go and \n> > make your own (but be sure to shell out money to your lawyer of choice to \n> > confirm that the GPL allows you to do that).\n> >\n> > The Git installer of msysGit will always show the GPL, and have the user \n> > accept it.\n> \n> I may be missing the details because I do not do Windows myself,\n> but if you are discussing the \"end user binary distribution\"\n> one, then I think:\n> \n>  * It is a mistake if you do not to show GPL, as you are\n>    redistributing GPL code in a binary form and you need to tell\n>    the end user his rights (e.g. he can request source for it,\n>    the source is found at a well known location, etc.)\n> \n>  * The restriction on redistribution of modified program would\n>    probably not apply (unless the receiver hacks binary) to most\n>    casual users, so making the label say \"I Accept\" feels a bit\n>    silly (but still is technically correct).  As Nico suggested,\n>    \"Continue\" may be fine here, as long as the message already\n>    says \"this program is distributed under this license you are\n>    looking at\".\n> \n> I recall you had another installer that gives the full\n> development environment for hack on \"git\" with a clone of the\n> git repository.  I do not know if you still offer that\n> installer, but \"I Accept\" would be very appropriate for that\n> one.\n\nYes, the full installer does not (yet) ask for acceptance of the GPL, \nbasically because I am too lazy, and also because I expect developers to \nactually read the notices in the copyright section in the source code, \nshould they modify the source.\n\nThe reasoning for showing the GPL in the Git installer I cannot explain, \nbecause I was not part of it.  However, I am very much in favour, for two \nreasons:\n\n- the end users should really know that the software is licensed in a \n  pretty free way.  Most of the users will have read about \"the GPL\", and \n  know what it says without reading it.  Others may see it for the first \n  time, and be astonished that such a license exists, and actually covers \n  a useful program.\n\n- _every_ serious Windows program comes with a click-through license.  We \n  just don't want to be left behind.\n\n- even if it would be not necessary to accept the license (which I am not \n  at all sure about, but do not care enough to learn about it, either), I \n  am not amused by somebody I do not know of, and who did not share \n  anything with me that I know of, asking me to remove that license \n  dialog.\n\n  If you are not okay with accepting a tit-for-tat license, well... I'll \n  not give you \"tat\".\n\nSo there is really nothing that I can think of, which would change my mind \nabout that \"issue\".\n\nCiao,\nDscho\n"},{"id":"67843","messageId":"20080207185214.GA28753@bit.office.eurotux.com","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LFD.1.00.0802071133230.2732@xanadu.home","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Luciano Rocha","fromEmail":"luciano@eurotux.com","sentAt":"2008-02-07T18:52:14Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T18:52:14Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"luciano@eurotux.com","avatar":null},"body":"On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 11:35:40AM -0500, Nicolas Pitre wrote:\n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n> \n> > On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:53:05AM -0500, Nicolas Pitre wrote:\n> > > What are they forced into if they indeed only want to _use_ Git?\n> > \n> > The msys git installer forces me to accept the GNU GPL in order to\n> > proceed.\n> > \n> > Of course, I can use another installer, or compile my own set of\n> > binaries. I just wanted to bring that case to attention, nothing else.\n> > \n> > > They nevertheless must be made aware of the rules they have to follow in \n> > > case the idea of redistributing it crosses their mind.\n> > \n> > I don't dispute that, only that I can't continue with the install unless\n> > I click on \"I Accept\" to the GNU GPL.\n> \n> Then, simply changing the button text from \"I accept\" to \"Continue\" \n> should be OK?\n\nIt has two radio-buttons with:\n\n* \"I accept the agreement\"\n* \"I do not accept the agreement\"\n\nThe latter one is the one selected by default, and until the user\nselects the \"I accept\", the \"Next>\" button is greyed-out.\n\nWhat I would suggest would be to remove both radio-buttons, and just leave\nthe \"Next>\" button active.\n\n-- \nLuciano Rocha <luciano@eurotux.com>\nEurotux Informática, S.A. <http://www.eurotux.com/>\n"},{"id":"67844","messageId":"20080207185524.GB28753@bit.office.eurotux.com","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071651440.8543-OGWIkrnhIhzN0uC3ymp8PA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Luciano Rocha","fromEmail":"luciano-ywehanl2klnbdgjk7y7tuq@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T18:55:24Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T18:55:24Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"luciano-ywehanl2klnbdgjk7y7tuq@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 04:53:43PM +0000, Johannes Schindelin wrote:\n> Hi,\n> \n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Nicolas Pitre wrote:\n> \n> > Then, simply changing the button text from \"I accept\" to \"Continue\" \n> > should be OK?\n> \n> I consider this bike-shedding, git-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org being the wrong mailing \n> list to discuss this (and as a matter of fact, the msysgit list is also \n> not the correct forum for discussing such legal/personal issues), and \n> besides, the msysgit installer will not be changed in this respect.\n\nI don't care much about that. I only installed the msysgit to have a\nbinary copy on my pen for using on friends' computers.\n\nI only thought it an unnecessary step, and w/o it the barrier-to-entry\nwould decrease slightly, as some people are put off by EULA.\n\nI never expect this level of hostility and I apologize if my question\nsounded as offensive.\n\nI respect the msysgit author/packager, and I thank him for his work.\n\n-- \nLuciano Rocha <luciano-YWehAnL2kLNBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org>\nEurotux Informática, S.A. <http://www.eurotux.com/>\n"},{"id":"67845","messageId":"20080207185923.GC28753@bit.office.eurotux.com","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071831520.8543-OGWIkrnhIhzN0uC3ymp8PA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Luciano Rocha","fromEmail":"luciano-ywehanl2klnbdgjk7y7tuq@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T18:59:23Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T18:59:23Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"luciano-ywehanl2klnbdgjk7y7tuq@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 06:40:28PM +0000, Johannes Schindelin wrote:\n> Hi,\n> \n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n> \n> > Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin-Mmb7MZpHnFY@public.gmane.org> writes:\n> > \n> > > Besides, if you do not like that our installer shows the GPL, just go and \n> > > make your own (but be sure to shell out money to your lawyer of choice to \n> > > confirm that the GPL allows you to do that).\n> > >\n> > > The Git installer of msysGit will always show the GPL, and have the user \n> > > accept it.\n> > \n> > I may be missing the details because I do not do Windows myself,\n> > but if you are discussing the \"end user binary distribution\"\n> > one, then I think:\n> > \n> >  * It is a mistake if you do not to show GPL, as you are\n> >    redistributing GPL code in a binary form and you need to tell\n> >    the end user his rights (e.g. he can request source for it,\n> >    the source is found at a well known location, etc.)\n> > \n> >  * The restriction on redistribution of modified program would\n> >    probably not apply (unless the receiver hacks binary) to most\n> >    casual users, so making the label say \"I Accept\" feels a bit\n> >    silly (but still is technically correct).  As Nico suggested,\n> >    \"Continue\" may be fine here, as long as the message already\n> >    says \"this program is distributed under this license you are\n> >    looking at\".\n> > \n> > I recall you had another installer that gives the full\n> > development environment for hack on \"git\" with a clone of the\n> > git repository.  I do not know if you still offer that\n> > installer, but \"I Accept\" would be very appropriate for that\n> > one.\n> \n> Yes, the full installer does not (yet) ask for acceptance of the GPL, \n> basically because I am too lazy, and also because I expect developers to \n> actually read the notices in the copyright section in the source code, \n> should they modify the source.\n> \n> The reasoning for showing the GPL in the Git installer I cannot explain, \n> because I was not part of it.  However, I am very much in favour, for two \n> reasons:\n> \n> - the end users should really know that the software is licensed in a \n>   pretty free way.  Most of the users will have read about \"the GPL\", and \n>   know what it says without reading it.  Others may see it for the first \n>   time, and be astonished that such a license exists, and actually covers \n>   a useful program.\n> \n> - _every_ serious Windows program comes with a click-through license.  We \n>   just don't want to be left behind.\n> \n> - even if it would be not necessary to accept the license (which I am not \n>   at all sure about, but do not care enough to learn about it, either), I \n>   am not amused by somebody I do not know of, and who did not share \n>   anything with me that I know of, asking me to remove that license \n>   dialog.\n\nI beg your pardon? I never asked you such thing. My first e-mail was,\nverbatim:\n-- begin --\nWhy do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n\nOnly the \"NO WARRANTY ...\" should be required, GPL is only required for\ndistribution (and you could make that information available at install).\n-- end --\n\nAny next e-mail in reply to this thread, from me, were only suggestions\nand reasonings for *not requiring acceptance*, not for removing the\nscreen.\n\n\n\n>   If you are not okay with accepting a tit-for-tat license, well... I'll \n>   not give you \"tat\".\n\nI never said I was. I mean, would I had sent a patch to this list if I\nwasn't OK with the license?\n\n> So there is really nothing that I can think of, which would change my mind \n> about that \"issue\".\n\nI was asking for the reasons for the installer being like it is, not for\nyou to change your mind.\n\n-- \nLuciano Rocha <luciano-YWehAnL2kLNBDgjK7y7TUQ@public.gmane.org>\nEurotux Informática, S.A. <http://www.eurotux.com/>\n"},{"id":"67847","messageId":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071906120.8543@racer.site","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080207185923.GC28753@bit.office.eurotux.com","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","sentAt":"2008-02-07T19:08:26Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T19:08:26Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/127790?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nOn Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n\n> I was asking for the reasons for the installer being like it is, not for \n> you to change your mind.\n\nI am sorry: I misunderstood.\n\nTwo reasons: we stay on the safe side (because no lawyer could now \npossible say that we forgot to present the license), and we want to give \nthe Git installer some \"professional\" look-and-feel ;-)\n\nPlease ignore my comments that offended you.\n\nCiao,\nDscho\n"},{"id":"67850","messageId":"7vprv8mu2k.fsf@gitster.siamese.dyndns.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071831520.8543@racer.site","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Junio C Hamano","fromEmail":"gitster@pobox.com","sentAt":"2008-02-07T19:42:59Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T19:42:59Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"gitster@pobox.com","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/54884?v=4"},"body":"Johannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin@gmx.de> writes:\n\n> - even if it would be not necessary to accept the license (which I am not \n>   at all sure about, but do not care enough to learn about it, either), I \n>   am not amused by somebody I do not know of, and who did not share \n>   anything with me that I know of, asking me to remove that license \n>   dialog.\n\nI think you need to grow a thicker skin.\n\nIt does not matter if the person is somebody you know or you\nhave shared with.  I'd grant you that Luciano could have been\nmore diplomatic when he started his message, but I'd agree that\nit is silly to refuse to install an end user program unless the\nend user agrees to GPL that governs how its sources can and\ncannot be used, especially if the installer does not even\ninstall the sources to the software.\n\nIn other words, consider his message as a bug report to the\ninstaller.\n\nI think removing the license dialog is a bad idea.  You need to\ntell the end-user about his rights, and one of the things is\nthat he can get source to git under the terms of GPLv2.  The bug\nis not about showing the license, but is about refusing to\ninstall unless the end user agrees with it.\n\n>   If you are not okay with accepting a tit-for-tat license, well... I'll \n>   not give you \"tat\".\n\nThe tit-for-tat in GPLv2 which we use is about \"I gave you my\nsource.  If you are going to work on my source and distribute\nthe result, you must promise me that I have the access to that\nmodified source of yours.  Otherwise you cannot work on it and\ndistribute the result.\"\n\nShowing the GPL (which says it does not cover the mere use of\nthe software) and then asking if the user accepts is merely\nabout:\n\n\t\"If and only if you are going to modify and distribute\n\tit, you must abide by the rules.  Do you understand?\"\n\nThe valid answers to the question would include \"I understand\",\n\"I do understand it, I do not like it, but I am not going to\nmodify and distribute it anyway\", and even \"I do not understand\nit, but I just want to use it\".  In any case, refusing to\ninstall unless the user says \"I agree\" feels silly.\n\nIf I were writing the installer, I would say in the dialog, \"git\nis distributed under GPL so you have the usual rights any GPLed\nsoftware comes with\", optionally show the GPL, and have a single\n\"Continue\" button.\n"},{"id":"67851","messageId":"20080207195839.GN30368@dpotapov.dyndns.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080207123108.GA12009-oEplIgxCSygGFt9iVWuREaMaJEuR8uiQ@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Dmitry Potapov","fromEmail":"dpotapov-re5jqeeqqe8avxtiumwx3w@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T19:58:39Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T19:58:39Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dpotapov-re5jqeeqqe8avxtiumwx3w@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nOn Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 12:31:09PM +0000, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n> \n> Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n> \n> Only the \"NO WARRANTY ...\" should be required, GPL is only required for\n> distribution (and you could make that information available at install).\n> \n\nSection 1 of the GPL requires to \"give any other recipients of the\nProgram a copy of this License along with the Program.\" AFAIK, showing\nthe License during installation is the traditional way to do so on\nWindows. Please, note that the GPL clearly states that distribution is\npossible \"provided that you conspicuously and appropriately publish on\neach copy an appropriate copyright notice and disclaimer of warranty.\"\nIANAL, but it appears to me that if an installer that does not follow\nthe traditional way (for the target system) of publishing the copyright\nnotice, may be found in violation of the later requirement, and thus\nany such distribution may deem as unlawful.\n\nSo, if you think about creating your own installer for Git, don't forget\nto consult to your lawyer...\n\nDmitry\n"},{"id":"67852","messageId":"alpine.LFD.1.00.0802071157360.2896@woody.linux-foundation.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"7vprv8mu2k.fsf-jO8aZxhGsIagbBziECNbOZn29agUkmeCHZ5vskTnxNA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Linus Torvalds","fromEmail":"torvalds-de/tnxtf+jlsfhdxvbkv3wd2fqjk+8+b@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T19:59:03Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T19:59:03Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"torvalds-de/tnxtf+jlsfhdxvbkv3wd2fqjk+8+b@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\n\n\nOn Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n> \n> I think removing the license dialog is a bad idea.  You need to\n> tell the end-user about his rights, and one of the things is\n> that he can get source to git under the terms of GPLv2.  The bug\n> is not about showing the license, but is about refusing to\n> install unless the end user agrees with it.\n\nYeah. Why not just rather than the whole ok/cancel discussion, go with a \nsingle button saying \"good for me!\" and be done with it.\n\nIOW, the license thing should be considered *informational* rather than a \nchoice. Because to a user, that's exactly what the GPL is. \n\n\t\tLinus\n"},{"id":"67854","messageId":"20080207202357.GO30368@dpotapov.dyndns.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"7vprv8mu2k.fsf-jO8aZxhGsIagbBziECNbOZn29agUkmeCHZ5vskTnxNA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Dmitry Potapov","fromEmail":"dpotapov-re5jqeeqqe8avxtiumwx3w@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T20:23:57Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T20:23:57Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dpotapov-re5jqeeqqe8avxtiumwx3w@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nOn Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 11:42:59AM -0800, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n> \n> It does not matter if the person is somebody you know or you\n> have shared with.  I'd grant you that Luciano could have been\n> more diplomatic when he started his message, but I'd agree that\n> it is silly to refuse to install an end user program unless the\n> end user agrees to GPL that governs how its sources can and\n> cannot be used, especially if the installer does not even\n> install the sources to the software.\n\nActually, the GPL is applied to the binary form too, and it\nprescribes how the program can be redistributed. There is no\nrestriction on how the user can run the program, but we still\nmust give to the user a copy of GPL in the appropriate way.\nBesides, the user should acknowledge that he or she is warned\nthe program is provided \"AS IS\" without warranty of any kind.\nIf the user cannot accept that, he or she should not run the\nprogram.\n\nSo, the current Git installer fully adheres to GPL requirements\nand installs Git in the traditional for Windows way. I don't\nsee anything here that can be considered as bug.\n\nDmitry\n"},{"id":"67857","messageId":"4C918ADB-6FF5-458E-AC81-5683850E1FE4@zib.de","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LFD.1.00.0802071157360.2896-5CScLwifNT1QetFLy7KEm3xJsTq8ys+cHZ5vskTnxNA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Steffen Prohaska","fromEmail":"prohaska-wjoc1khpmeg@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T20:58:12Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T20:58:12Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"prohaska-wjoc1khpmeg@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\n\nOn Feb 7, 2008, at 8:59 PM, Linus Torvalds wrote:\n>\n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n>>\n>> I think removing the license dialog is a bad idea.  You need to\n>> tell the end-user about his rights, and one of the things is\n>> that he can get source to git under the terms of GPLv2.  The bug\n>> is not about showing the license, but is about refusing to\n>> install unless the end user agrees with it.\n>\n> Yeah. Why not just rather than the whole ok/cancel discussion, go  \n> with a\n> single button saying \"good for me!\" and be done with it.\n>\n> IOW, the license thing should be considered *informational* rather  \n> than a\n> choice. Because to a user, that's exactly what the GPL is.\n\nOk, if there are no further objections, we'll do that.\n\nSebastian,\ncan we easily modify the license dialog with Inno Setup?\nThe license should be displayed and a single click should\nbe sufficient to \"continue\".\n\n\tSteffen\n"},{"id":"67858","messageId":"87y79wa3a5.fsf@jbms.ath.cx","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071906120.8543-OGWIkrnhIhzN0uC3ymp8PA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Jeremy Maitin-Shepard","fromEmail":"jbms-d+gtc/hyrwm@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T21:02:26Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T21:02:26Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jbms-d+gtc/hyrwm@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nJohannes Schindelin <Johannes.Schindelin-Mmb7MZpHnFY@public.gmane.org> writes:\n\n> Hi,\n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n\n>> I was asking for the reasons for the installer being like it is, not for \n>> you to change your mind.\n\n> I am sorry: I misunderstood.\n\n> Two reasons: we stay on the safe side (because no lawyer could now \n> possible say that we forgot to present the license), and we want to give \n> the Git installer some \"professional\" look-and-feel ;-)\n\nIt is not unreasonable, I suppose, to display the license text in the\ninstaller program, though I think it is sufficient to provide the\nlicense in a simple LICENSE file, and it is hard to imagine anyone\nactually wanting to read the license text while installing git.\n\nI think it is not a good idea for a nice free software program like git\nto show license text in a click-wrap way, as that will only give\ncredence to click-wrap licenses.\n\nAs far as the \"professional\" look and feel, rather than make git seem\nmore like the usual proprietary program (if you wanted to go that route,\nperhaps you should bundle a root kit/\"copy protection\nmechanism\"/adware/spyware like companies will often do :) ), I'd suggest\nmaking it seem much _better_ than the usual proprietary program: the\nuser can look at the opportunity to install a program without having to\n\"agree\" to onerous terms as a breath of fresh air.\n\nAs has been mentioned, installing and running the program is permitted\nby fair use, and thus assuming he already has a copy of the software,\nlegally there is no need for the user to agree to any additional terms\nbefore using the software.  The traditional EULA attempts to use\ntechnical means to prevent the user from exercising his fair use rights;\nin particular, it attempts to force the user to agree to certain terms\nfor essentially no compensation, as he already has fair use permission\nto use the software anyway.  Naturally, such use of technical means is\ncompletely antithetical to the idea of free software.\n\n-- \nJeremy Maitin-Shepard\n"},{"id":"67864","messageId":"57518fd10802071349w50446803q249cbda0e2998bc5@mail.gmail.com","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080207202357.GO30368@dpotapov.dyndns.org","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Jonathan del Strother","fromEmail":"maillist@steelskies.com","sentAt":"2008-02-07T21:49:45Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T21:49:45Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jon.delstrother@bestbefore.tv","avatar":"https://gravatar.com/avatar/754e21ab701c00e2d21fc261187254c34b2a1c0b959d9ee5be1a295990be3081?d=mp&s=160"},"body":"On Feb 7, 2008 8:23 PM, Dmitry Potapov <dpotapov@gmail.com> wrote:\n> On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 11:42:59AM -0800, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n> >\n> > It does not matter if the person is somebody you know or you\n> > have shared with.  I'd grant you that Luciano could have been\n> > more diplomatic when he started his message, but I'd agree that\n> > it is silly to refuse to install an end user program unless the\n> > end user agrees to GPL that governs how its sources can and\n> > cannot be used, especially if the installer does not even\n> > install the sources to the software.\n>\n> Actually, the GPL is applied to the binary form too, and it\n> prescribes how the program can be redistributed. There is no\n> restriction on how the user can run the program, but we still\n> must give to the user a copy of GPL in the appropriate way.\n> Besides, the user should acknowledge that he or she is warned\n> the program is provided \"AS IS\" without warranty of any kind.\n> If the user cannot accept that, he or she should not run the\n> program.\n>\n\nJust out of curiosity - does this mean that MacPorts (a fink-like\npackage manager for OS X) ought to display the license while\ninstalling?  Or does that somehow not apply here?\n"},{"id":"67868","messageId":"20080207221837.GQ30368@dpotapov.dyndns.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"57518fd10802071349w50446803q249cbda0e2998bc5-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Dmitry Potapov","fromEmail":"dpotapov-re5jqeeqqe8avxtiumwx3w@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T22:18:37Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T22:18:37Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"dpotapov-re5jqeeqqe8avxtiumwx3w@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nOn Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 09:49:45PM +0000, Jonathan del Strother wrote:\n> \n> Just out of curiosity - does this mean that MacPorts (a fink-like\n> package manager for OS X) ought to display the license while\n> installing?  Or does that somehow not apply here?\n\nUnfortunately, I don't know much about OS X and the packet manager\nyou mentioned, but from common sense, I would say you should place\nthe copyright notice at the place where users traditionally can find\nit when install other programs on that platform...\n\nDmitry\n"},{"id":"67871","messageId":"fxw4v0zn.fsf@blue.sea.net","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071831520.8543@racer.site","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Jari Aalto","fromEmail":"jari.aalto-w6ebcrcxq4deowh0uzbu5w@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T22:46:20Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T22:46:20Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"jari.aalto-w6ebcrcxq4deowh0uzbu5w@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\n* Thu 2008-02-07 Johannes Schindelin-Mmb7MZpHnFY <Johannes.Schindelin-Mmb7MZpHnFY@public.gmane.org>\n* Message-Id: alpine.LSU.1.00.0802071831520.8543-OGWIkrnhIhzN0uC3ymp8PA@public.gmane.org\n> The reasoning for showing the GPL in the Git installer..in favour, for two \n> reasons:\n>\n> - the end users should really know that the software is licensed in a \n>   pretty free way.\n\nNo they don't. The git binary is free in its distributable form and\nneeds therefore no such \"EULA to be clicked\".\n\nGit is distributed everywhere else without \"press the button to\nbypass/accept/whatever reading the GPL\". Let's not make some platform,\nand a specific version of it, an exception.\n\nFYI, Windows / Cygwin, version does not require user to click past such\n\"EULA\".\n\n> - _every_ serious Windows program comes with a click-through license.  We \n>   just don't want to be left behind.\n\nNo they don't. Have a look at vast number of Freeware software out there\nwww.nonags.com, tucows etc. They do not at all require such measures.\n\nAnd yes, Freeware is serious software for Windows users.\n\n> - even if it would be not necessary to accept the license (which I am not \n>   at all sure about\n\nRedhat, The big company, has allowed the hosted Cygwin project to\ndistribute GPL software for ages under Windows. And their lawyers *have*\ncertainly checked that Cygwin installer does not need user to click \"GPL\nEULA\" to have Cygwin installed.\n\nThat pretty much proves that there is no need for \"read LICENCE to\ninstall\" button to be present.\n\nJari\n\n-- \nWelcome to FOSS revolution: we fix and modify until it shines\n"},{"id":"67872","messageId":"alpine.LFD.1.00.0802071433461.2896@woody.linux-foundation.org","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"20080207221837.GQ30368-EQL4cN526mwi5CQI31g/s0B+6BGkLq7r@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Linus Torvalds","fromEmail":"torvalds-de/tnxtf+jlsfhdxvbkv3wd2fqjk+8+b@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-07T22:48:26Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-07T22:48:26Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"torvalds-de/tnxtf+jlsfhdxvbkv3wd2fqjk+8+b@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\n\n\nOn Fri, 8 Feb 2008, Dmitry Potapov wrote:\n> \n> Unfortunately, I don't know much about OS X and the packet manager\n> you mentioned, but from common sense, I would say you should place\n> the copyright notice at the place where users traditionally can find\n> it when install other programs on that platform...\n\nWell, the rule in the license is \"provided that you conspicuously and \nappropriately publish on each copy an appropriate copyright notice and \ndisclaimer of warranty\".\n\nWhat exactly that means is not something people generally agree about. \nWhat some consider \"conspicuous\", others consider very much \"rude and \ninappropriate\", so \"conspicuously and appropriately\" is simply something \nthat people have to find a balance for.\n\nIn general, your common sense interpretation is probably the best legal \none too: place the copyright notice about as conspicuously as the user \nwould be expect it to be placed.\n\nOn traditional UNIX platforms (including Linux), that tends to be \"make it \na README file or perhaps note it in the man-pages\". On OS X and Windows, \nwhat is considered appropriate is probably different.\n\nThere is definitely no *requirement* of annoying pop-up click-throughs. In \nfact, I would say that something like that would be wholly in-appropriate \nand not at all in the spirit of the GPL on UNIX, where people expect \ninstallation to not be an interactive process.\n\n[ Related side note: but at the same time, if a developer actually starts \n  adding those kinds of pop-ups, it's sometimes arguably against the GPL \n  to remove them!\n\n  See 2(c), which says that you have to announce the license when an \n  interactive program is run *if* the announcement was there originally!\n\n  So I actually would encourage people who do GPL'd programs to never add \n  those kinds of annoying interactive license notices, because they can be \n  hard to remove legally! ]\n\nIn short: it's a cultural issue which way you want to go, but some care \nshould be taken. I come from a Unix background, so I find graphical \ninstalls be really really annoying, and if I see a popup, I just *hate* \nit. I'd consider it obnoxious and irritating as hell. But I suspect that \nWindows people really do expect it.\n\n\t\t\t\tLinus\n"},{"id":"67882","messageId":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802080143440.11591@racer.site","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"4C918ADB-6FF5-458E-AC81-5683850E1FE4@zib.de","subject":"Re: [msysGit] Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Johannes Schindelin","fromEmail":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","sentAt":"2008-02-08T01:53:14Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-08T01:53:14Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"johannes.schindelin@gmx.de","avatar":"https://avatars.githubusercontent.com/u/127790?v=4"},"body":"Hi,\n\nOn Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Steffen Prohaska wrote:\n\n> On Feb 7, 2008, at 8:59 PM, Linus Torvalds wrote:\n> > \n> > On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Junio C Hamano wrote:\n> > > \n> > > I think removing the license dialog is a bad idea.  You need to tell \n> > > the end-user about his rights, and one of the things is that he can \n> > > get source to git under the terms of GPLv2.  The bug is not about \n> > > showing the license, but is about refusing to install unless the end \n> > > user agrees with it.\n> > \n> > Yeah. Why not just rather than the whole ok/cancel discussion, go with \n> > a single button saying \"good for me!\" and be done with it.\n> > \n> > IOW, the license thing should be considered *informational* rather \n> > than a choice. Because to a user, that's exactly what the GPL is.\n> \n> Ok, if there are no further objections, we'll do that.\n> \n> Sebastian, can we easily modify the license dialog with Inno Setup? The \n> license should be displayed and a single click should be sufficient to \n> \"continue\".\n\nIt looks like \"LicenseFile\" is a special variable in InnoSetup, and it is \nnot _that_ easy to change it to an \"I am okay with it; I read it\" text.  \nMaybe something like the release notes would be good (\"Source: ... Flags: \nisreadme\")?\n\nIn any case, I think this discussion has outlived its usefulness: there \nare _many_ _more_ pressing issues with msysGit.\n\nHaving said that, I am really amazed that we seem to finally have picked \nup some Windows experts...  So my hopes are high for a catch-up with \ngit.git that will lead to an msysGit-from-git.git soon!\n\nFor example, the git-svn issue seems resolved now (thanks Simon, Christian \nand Mike -- I call them the \"S-C-M\" gang).  If we can squeeze better \nperformance out of it, all the better.\n\ngit-cheetah also appears to gather way nicely: it seems that the only \nobstacle is my own laziness (and admittedly, lack of time) to review the \nchanges and push them!\n\nHoist the anchors,\nDscho\n"},{"id":"67913","messageId":"E6DFE65BB5ADFE44BE13CCC976124447D5BCC8@fue-email2.ad.mc.com","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LSU.1.00.0802080143440.11591-OGWIkrnhIhzN0uC3ymp8PA@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Schuberth, Sebastian","fromEmail":"sschuberth-b1n3u3u3aezwaa3ho+uhnwc/g2k4zdhf@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-08T09:22:17Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-08T09:22:17Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"sschuberth-b1n3u3u3aezwaa3ho+uhnwc/g2k4zdhf@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\n> > Sebastian, can we easily modify the license dialog with Inno Setup? \n> > The license should be displayed and a single click should be \n> > sufficient to \"continue\".\n> \n> It looks like \"LicenseFile\" is a special variable in \n> InnoSetup, and it is not _that_ easy to change it to an \"I am \n> okay with it; I read it\" text.  \n\nActually, the modification was trivial, I'm now using \"InfoBeforeFile\"\ninstead of \"LicenseFile\". I've pushed Steffen the change.\n\n-- \nSebastian\n"},{"id":"67930","messageId":"1ACC7F45-46D2-4CBE-B3F7-61B67376006B@zib.de","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"E6DFE65BB5ADFE44BE13CCC976124447D5BCC8-xoGCv1uRt2M6PgvdBIHKsVaTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Steffen Prohaska","fromEmail":"prohaska-wjoc1khpmeg@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-08T11:14:02Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-08T11:14:02Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"prohaska-wjoc1khpmeg@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\n\nOn Feb 8, 2008, at 10:22 AM, Schuberth, Sebastian wrote:\n\n>\n>>> Sebastian, can we easily modify the license dialog with Inno Setup?\n>>> The license should be displayed and a single click should be\n>>> sufficient to \"continue\".\n>>\n>> It looks like \"LicenseFile\" is a special variable in\n>> InnoSetup, and it is not _that_ easy to change it to an \"I am\n>> okay with it; I read it\" text.\n>\n> Actually, the modification was trivial, I'm now using \"InfoBeforeFile\"\n> instead of \"LicenseFile\". I've pushed Steffen the change.\n\nI pushed the commit to msysgit.git onto branch work/innosetup:\n\nhttp://repo.or.cz/w/msysgit.git?a=commitdiff;h=f66b8578722\n\nI'll test it later and will include it in the next release if\nnobody raises further objections.\n\n\tSteffen\n"},{"id":"68059","messageId":"47AD7191.3040209@op5.se","threadId":"11825","inReplyTo":"alpine.LFD.1.00.0802070949460.2732-QuJgVwGFrdf/9pzu0YdTqQ@public.gmane.org","subject":"Re: [ANNOUNCE] GIT 1.5.4","fromName":"Andreas Ericsson","fromEmail":"ae-n0zl8ikgad4@public.gmane.org","sentAt":"2008-02-09T09:25:37Z","receivedAt":"2008-02-09T09:25:37Z","isPatch":false,"sender":{"key":"ae-n0zl8ikgad4@public.gmane.org","avatar":null},"body":"\nNicolas Pitre wrote:\n> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n> \n>> On Thu, Feb 07, 2008 at 12:55:58PM +0000, Johannes Schindelin wrote:\n>>> Hi,\n>>>\n>>> On Thu, 7 Feb 2008, Luciano Rocha wrote:\n>>>\n>>>> Why do I have to accept the GPL to install msysgit?\n>>> Because that's the only license you have to use git.\n>> Again, GPL governs distribution, not use.\n>>\n>>> Get over it, or use another SCM,\n>> I like and use GPL, but I won't force my users to accept the GPL in\n>> order to use programs released under it.\n> \n> What are they forced into if they indeed only want to _use_ Git?\n> \n> They nevertheless must be made aware of the rules they have to follow in \n> case the idea of redistributing it crosses their mind.\n> \n\nNo, because redistributing software is always illegal unless explicitly\npermitted. The GPL explicitly permits it, so they have to find that\npiece of license, read it, determine \"oh this is ok then\" and then go\nahead and email it to their friends.\n\nSeriously though, the only thing I expect nobody would want to is\nthat some company starts distributing git as their own scm, under a\ndifferent license and probably closed-source too. EFF can provide\nlawyer help for such cases. Such a company would obviously read the\nlicense and realise that it's impossible for them to do so.\n\n-- \nAndreas Ericsson                   andreas.ericsson-n0Zl8IkGad4@public.gmane.org\nOP5 AB                             www.op5.se\nTel: +46 8-230225                  Fax: +46 8-230231\n"}]}